Transport: Co-ordination (Hansard, 8 February 1989)

§ Viscount Davidson
My Lords, the Government believe that demand for transport is best met by maximising consumer choice, by ensuring that transport operators act as far as possible in accordance with commercial objectives, by targeting subsidy on specific social needs and by encouraging co-operation between transport authorities where appropriate.

§ Lord Graham of Edmonton
My Lords, I am grateful to the Minister for that Answer. Does the Minister share my view that congestion on the roads should be diminished wherever possible? If he does share my view, would he care to comment on the recent cancellation by British Rail of the concessionary fares that it operated for conference delegates? In the light of that, does not the Minister agree that there is a likelihood that displaced rail travellers will add to the congestion on the roads? What does he intend to do about it?

§ Viscount Davidson
My Lords, I understand that special conference rate facilities are to be withdrawn at the end of April. But such promotional fares are a matter for British Rail's judgment. British Rail's research showed that less than 5 per cent. of people going to conferences by rail use this promotional fare. Its withdrawal is unlikely to have any significant effect on road traffic.

§ Lord Mellish
My Lords, as the Question was about co-ordinated transport, has the Minister taken into account the fact that running alongside the House of Commons or the Palace of Westminster there is the greatest river in the world, the River Thames. It is not used at all except by the odd sightseer. Can the Minister say what plans the Government have for making the river come to life?

§ Viscount Davidson
My Lords, I have a great deal of sympathy for what the noble Lord, Lord Mellish, says. I shall certainly draw his remarks to the attention of my right honourable friend.

§ Lord Ferrier
My Lords, does the noble Viscount agree that the present difficulty as regards the development of rail connections with Prestwick Airport is typical of the point to which the noble Lord, Lord Graham, is referring? Much of the development there is held up by a lack of liaison between rail and air.

§ Viscount Davidson
My Lords, I am aware of my noble friend's interest in that railway. Again I shall certainly draw his remarks to the attention of my noble friend.

§ Lord Underhill
My Lords, does the noble Viscount agree that his original Answer to my noble friend means that the Government have no policy at all on endeavouring themselves to get co-ordination between all methods of transport? As the Question said, that would he in the national interest. Are the Government prepared to look into the matter?

§ Viscount Davidson
My Lords, we believe that the national interest is best served by creating the right economic environment and providing for freedom of choice. It is for public transport operators to decide how they can best meet passengers' requirements.

§ Lord Crickhowell
My Lords, while supporting the point made by the noble Lord, Lord Mellish, perhaps I may ask my noble friend at least to seek to ensure that tug operators and refuse barges do not collide with London bridges. Will the noble Viscount urge that most urgent priority be given to the repair of Battersea Bridge, which is closed, totally dislocating an important part of London's traffic system? The very sensible proposals by the local Member of Parliament, Mr. Bowis, that the lighting systems and traffic flows on neighbouring bridges should be reviewed should also be looked at as a matter of great urgency.

§ Viscount Davidson
My Lords, I congratulate my noble friend on getting that question into this Question! The Department of Transport is capable of many things, but it would be a miracle if we were able to cure that problem in a very short time. However, I can assure the noble Lord that my right honourable friend will do everything he can.

§ Lord Ezra
My Lords, does not the noble Viscount agree that there is increasing public concern about congestion and delays in transport? Is it not therefore the task of any government, whatever their party political view, to take that concern seriously into account and to make suggestions as to how this big national problem can be resolved?

§ Viscount Davidson
My Lords, I think that everyone agrees that there is congestion on motorways, railways and airways and that reflects economic growth right through the whole of Europe and the whole of the western world. It might be of interest to the House if I said that my right honourable friend the Secretary of State for Transport published on 26th January the report of the central London rail study. That makes proposals for a £1.5 billion major upgrading programme on 1558 London's railways. It also contains proposals for new railway lines and tunnels under central London. On the same day, my right honourable friend published a booklet on transport in London which described the Government's strategic framework for London's transport. Copies of both these documents are available in the Library of the House.

§ Lord Cledwyn of Penrhos
My Lords, if congestion in this country continues as at present, and specifically if it continues in London, does not the noble Viscount agree that economic growth will be seriously slowed up? Can he say, first, what the Government are proposing to do about solving London's traffic problem? The papers to which the noble Viscount has referred are no solution at all. Why do the Government not take some specific action to deal with the matter?
Further, do the Government believe in a coordinated transport policy? If so, why do they not produce a White Paper which the country and Parliament can debate so that we may know exactly where we are going? At the moment the country does not know where it is going on the issue.

§ Viscount Davidson
My Lords, at least the noble Lord the Leader of the Opposition said that the country is going. Schemes worth over £5 billion are under construction or in preparation. The comprehensive review of road programmes is currently in hand and we expect to announce the outcome in the spring. Where public transport can help to reduce road congestion, the Government will consider subsidies in public transport.

§ Lord Dormand of Easington
My Lords, why has the Minister not said something about the most effective form of transport; namely, cycling? Does he not agree that it is healthy, non-polluting and does not add to traffic congestion? When will the Government do something about that, not least in making additional cycling lanes available to cyclists? Finally, as the person in charge of the House bicycles, may I invite any of your Lordships who have a machine to see me afterwards?

§ Viscount Davidson
My Lords, I said nothing about cycling because I was not asked. However, I certainly agree with the noble Lord that cycling is healthy and very good for one. I wish him every success in his future cycling.

§ Lord Graham of Edmonton
My Lords, the Minister fairly said that the peg upon which I hung this Question—that is, the abolition of concessionary fares—only affects 5 per cent. of people who attend conferences. But is the Minister aware that that 5 per cent. can involve many thousands of people who will add to the congestion on the roads? Will the Minister take on board the mood of the House which is that while we want our various forms of transport to develop and grow more successful, we also want to ensure that there is co-ordination and not competition in the national interest?

§ Viscount Davidson
My Lords, I shall certainly take that on board.