HL Deb 23 June 1988 vol 498 cc915-6

Baroness Burton of Coventry asked Her Majesty's Government:

Whether they will make a statement on aviation matters discussed and decisions taken at the meetings of the European Community Transport Ministers' Council held on 14th/15th March, 25th/26th April and 20th/21st June.

Viscount Davidson

My Lords, the only aviation matters taken by the Council itself were reports by the Commission on relations between the European Community and the European Civil Aviation Conference, and on a proposed amendment to the 1983 Inter-regional Air Services Directive. Both matters were referred back to officials for further work. In addition, at a separate meeting on 20th June Ministers exchanged views on air traffic control capacity.

Baroness Burton of Coventry

My Lords, believing that the most effective and radical solution to the problems of European aviation in the 1990s must be an effective co-ordination between the European Community and those European states not in the Community, will the Minister tell the House whether that Answer in general covers the possibility of such discussions? Does he agree with me that the present civil aviation package is only transitory and that we must expect further liberalisation?

Viscount Davidson

My Lords, I agree entirely with the noble Baroness on her last point. Work carried out in the European Civil Aviation Conference on market access and air fares had a substantial influence on the EC aviation package. The two organisations will continue to work together to achieve the maximum liberalisation in air transport throughout Europe.

Lord Underhill

My Lords, the Minister referred to the question of control. Do I take it that the Transport Ministers' Council considered the problem which has been increasingly mentioned in all circles: the overcrowding of air space and the possibility of a European air control system? Has that been considered? Was consideration also given to the growing complaints of the congestion at certain airports, particularly those in certain European countries due to charter flights interfering with scheduled flights?

Viscount Davidson

My Lords, the mechanisms for co-ordination and co-operation certainly exist, principally through the International Civil Aviation Organisation and Eurocontrol. The House might like to know that the reason I am answering this Question is because my noble friend Lord Brabazon of Tara is spending three days at Eurocontrol on a fact-finding mission prior to chairing the permanent commission of Eurocontrol on 5th July.

Baroness Burton of Coventry

My Lords, can the Minister tell the House whether he knows the date of the next meeting of the Transport Ministers' Council? While being gratified at the part affirmative (if not wholly affirmative) Answer to the first Question, did I understand the Minister to say that what I had asked about— the co-operation between the two different groups of countries— would be under discussion?

Viscount Davidson

Yes, my Lords. I hope that I can fully satisfy the noble Baroness by saying that the Greek Presidency is planning to hold transport councils in October and December of this year. But we need not wait until then. We shall continue to build bilaterally on the liberalisation contained in the December package, as we have done in the recent agreement with Ireland.

Lord Northfield

My Lords, can the noble Viscount make clear what is really holding up liberalisation in key routes such as London to Paris? Is it not a scandal that the regular fare— the return round trip Paris fare— is £ 170, even if one is only going for the day? That is the cost of flying across the Atlantic. Can the Minister make clear whether it is British Airways, the British Government, Air France or the French Government which is stopping real competition and liberalisation on that route?

Viscount Davidson

My Lords, I am not sure whether I can answer that question. But I can assure the noble Lord it is not the British Government.

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