National Engineering Laboratory (Hansard, 10 June 1988)

§ The Secretary of State for Trade and Industry (Lord Young of Graffham)
My Lords, I am inviting proposals only from organisations which already have experience of carrying out research and development and I have made clear that any acceptable proposals must involve the development of NEL as a contract research organisation. Contract research organisations must maintain a reputation for independence since their success depends on it. I should also be happy to receive proposals from NEL staff and this too would maintain NEL's current reputation. I have placed a copy of the notes of guidance for potential bidders in the Library.

§ Lord Carmichael of Kelvingrove
My Lords, before I speak on the Question I should like to say a word about the fact that my noble friend Lord Ross of Marnock—who directly preceded me in this job and who was a Member of this and of the other House for a long time—died this morning after a fairly long illness. I am sure that the House will wish to convey its sorrow to Lady Ross and her family.

Noble Lords
Hear, hear!

§ Lord Carmichael of Kelvingrove
My Lords, I thank the Minister for his Answer. He will realise that the announcement of the closure was a shock to the people of Scotland, despite the fact that he visited NEL some weeks ago. He made statements there which were interpreted as meaning that the Government were to withdraw from the NEL. Nevertheless it came as a great shock to learn that the last important and prestigious government-sponsored research establishment in Scotland will change in status.
Is the Minister aware that the independence of the National Engineering Laboratory's research and evaluation of systems and high-tech products was one of its great strengths? Is he also aware that it can never be the same, particularly in its pure research and evaluation, if it has too strong a link with industry?
The Minister may be aware that during the Californian government's efforts to obtain large pumping equipment for the watercourses running 1608 along each side of the San Andreas Fault they could not find a single college or research facility in America which did not have some industrial tie-up with the NEL. They brought their equipment over for testing by the NEL. Is the Minister aware that that is the kind of institution that we may lose in Scotland?

§ Lord Young of Graffham
My Lords, we on this side of the House should also like to pay tribute to the noble Lord, Lord Ross. We shall certainly miss his advice and wise counsel to your Lordships' House.

Noble Lords
Hear, hear!

§ Lord Young of Graffham
My Lords, if the National Engineering Laboratory is to fulfil its function, which is to provide independent research and development of which our industrial base in this country can take advantage, it is important that it has better links with the private sector. In doing that we anticipate enhancing the National Engineering Laboratory in order to make it more relevant to the work that is being carried out. I have no reason to suppose that it will not be a better research organisation as soon as it is in private sector hands.
There are many ways in which the laboratory can go into the private sector. The notes of guidance, a copy of which I have placed in the Library, will show that we are insisting that it will do so only under the control of an existing organisation which has a good record in contract research and development. Part of the work at NEL concerns measurements and standards of flow, which is part of the national measurement system. For that reason we are taking steps to ensure that that work will not leave state ownership. However, its management could or could not be with the new organisation. We are also taking steps to ensure that research and development work will continue on the site and that it will not in the future be used for other purposes.

§ Lord Carmichael of Kelvingrove
My Lords, I thank the Minister for announcing that he has placed a copy of the notes of guidance in the Library and that he will send a copy to me. Perhaps after it has been thoroughly studied we can discuss the matter again.

§ Lord Mackie of Benshie
My Lords, can the Minister say whether any independent body will remain to assess the varied work that the NEL carried out in the past?

§ Lord Young of Graffham
My Lords, no, I was referring specifically to the national measurement system on flow measurement. The notes of guidance suggest that that part of its work and the specific building concerned could be either a self-contained, free-standing agency within government or it could continue to be owned by government with its management given over to the new organisation. We are awaiting detailed proposals in order to decide which alternative will work best.