§ 3.24 p.m.
§ Lord Molloy asked Her Majesty's Government:
§ Whether they will raise in the United Nations the imprisonment of increasing numbers of Palestinians by Israel.
§ The Minister of State, Foreign and Commonwealth Office (Lord Glenarthur)My Lords, we have made clear, in the United Nations and elsewhere, our view that the Israeli authorities should respect international law and human rights standards in their administration of the occupied territories. We shall continue to take appropriate opportunities to do so.
§ Lord MolloyMy Lords, I am grateful to the Minister for that reply. Does he not agree and is he not aware that, in addition to imprisonment without trial, there now can be added deportation and collective punishment; that all these things offend the Fourth Geneva Convention and the Universal Declaration on Human Rights; and that there are very many, particularly young, Israelis who have expressed grave apprehension about their Government's activities in the occupied territories? Will Britain do a little more, perhaps with the United States, to influence even more the Israeli Government because they are creating a highly explosive situation which, unless we are very careful, could involve very many nations?
§ Lord GlenarthurMy Lords, we deplore the illegal actions, such as to those which the noble Lord has referred, including deportations, collective punishment, house demolitions and all that sort of thing. Deportation is contrary to international law and will only create new martyrs to the Palestinian cause and fuel resentment.
I am quite sure that the noble Lord will also feel that we should continue to support Mr. Shultz in his efforts, and that is certainly what we shall do.
§ Lord BottomleyMy Lords, does the Minister not agree that, if the PLO were to recognise the state of Israel and to adopt the appropriate United Nations resolutions, there would be no need to imprison Palestinians?
§ Lord GlenarthurMy Lords, I believe it is the concern of all your Lordships that we should seek a satisfactory conclusion to what has gone on there for many years. We believe that implementation of Security Council Resolution 242 remains the main goal to be achieved. As part of the proposal the Israelis should withdraw from the territories occupied since 1967 and meanwhile should administer its occupation in compliance with international law and human rights standards.
§ Lord Cledwyn of PenrhosMy Lords, I warmly welcome what the noble Lord has said about the 1143 laudable efforts that Mr. Shultz is making in very difficult circumstances. Can the Minister say how Her Majesty's Government see the process of negotiation proceeding at the present time? Will he give an assurance that Her Majesty's Government will give Mr. Shultz every assistance in the efforts he is making?
§ Lord GlenarthurYes, my Lords, of course we greatly welcome the new United States engagement. It is a vital ingredient. My right honourable and learned friend the Foreign Secretary has made that absolutely clear. We are keeping in close touch with Mr. Shultz and we hope that he will continue his efforts. It is for the parties themselves to decide whether the United States initiative represents a sound basis for progress, but we certainly urge them not to reject or stifle this important opportunity for peace.
The Lord Bishop of St. AlbansMy Lords, as someone who for the past two months has been living in East Jerusalem, I should like to express gratitude to the Minister for the way in which the Question has been answered. Are the British Government prepared to take up with the Government of Israel the case of Dr. Mubarak Awad, who is a highly respected Palestinian Christian advocating non-violent resistance to Israeli military occupation and who has been rewarded for his pains by the threat of expulsion from the land? I am wondering whether he would care to point out to the Government of Israel that it is only by retaining these people in the territories that they will have non-violent people with whom they can discuss the future of the territories.
§ Lord GlenarthurMy Lords, I assure the right reverend Prelate that we have taken up with the Israeli authorities a number of individual cases. I cannot tell him whether that case is one of them but I shall certainly consider it.
§ Lord KennetMy Lords, the noble Lord has stated that the Government believe that Israel should abide by the United Nations resolutions. He has also stated that the Government support Mr. Shultz's present initiative. Can he say whether Mr. Shultz is urging Israel to abide by those UN resolutions? Can he also say whether Mr. Shultz is telling Israel that unless she abides by those resolutions he will reduce the flow of American military aid?
§ Lord GlenarthurMy Lords, perhaps that is a matter which the noble Lord should address directly to the country concerned. It is important that this country and this Government do all they can to support Mr. Shultz in the important efforts that he is making.
Lord ChelwoodNonetheless, my Lords, is not Mr. Shultz unfortunately greatly inhibited by the fact that the United States Government firmly refuse to recognise the Palestinian people's right to self-determination? That is clearly recognised in the Venice Declaration by all the European Community countries.
§ Lord GlenarthurMy Lords, that may be my noble friend's view. I have stated before that the PLO cannot expect to play a full part in negotiations until it accepts the United Nations Security Council Resolutions 242 and 338, renounces violence and accepts Israel's right to exist.
§ Lord MolloyMy Lords, will the Minister agree that before this highly explosive situation develops into a massive war in the Middle East, which will draw in other countries as well, the time has come for action? It is an appalling paradox that the United Nations which created the state of Israel is being totally defied by the state of Israel. We should back the Americans and Mr. Shultz and all other countries that want to see fair play and the abolition—
§ Lord MolloyThis is the question—the abolition of all the injustices—
§ Lord Molloy—being perpetrated upon the Palestinians, and those in the occupied territories should be removed so that we can move forward—
§ Lord Molloy—to a peaceful endeavour.
§ Lord GlenarthurMy Lords, if Mr. Shultz's activities are not "action" I do not know what is.