§ 3.13 p.m.
§ Lord BeswickMy Lords, I beg leave to ask the Question standing in my name on the Order Paper.
The Question was as follows:
To ask Her Majesty's Government whether they are satisfied with the progress made at the JET nuclear fusion project and whether all professional staff, irrespective of nationality, now enjoy common salary scales.
§ Viscount DavidsonMy Lords, though much remains to be done, the latest results from JET have been encouraging. A peak temperature of 140 million degrees centigrade has been reached. The project is staffed by the member organisations of the project according to the statutes of the joint undertaking. Staff made available to the project by the UKAEA remain subject to its own conditions of service and are paid accordingly. The European Court has upheld these arrangements and rules that they do not discriminate on grounds of nationality.
§ Lord BeswickMy Lords, I am grateful to the noble Viscount for his reply. Would he not agree that, despite what he said at the beginning of his Answer, there is a lowering of morale at that plant? Would he not further agree that it is quite impossible to maintain the necessary morale and motivation if you have this 1518 gross disparity between the salaries'paid to the English people on the one hand and the other Europeans on the other? Will he confirm that at the present time the English are getting half the salary paid to the other European scientists alongside whom they work?
§ Viscount DavidsonMy Lords, the judgment of the European Court is not against the United Kingdom Atomic Energy Authority or the British Government. The case was brought against the JET Council and the Commission of the European Communities, and they defended the action. The European Court upheld the existing arrangements embodied in the JET statutes and concluded that the difference in treatment between UKAEA staff and staff made available by other members of the joint undertaking is objectively justified bv the particular circumstances applicable to JET.
§ The Earl of LauderdaleMy Lords, can my noble friend add to what he said about the progress of the JET project when he referred to a temperature of 140 million degrees centigrade having been attained? Can he say whether that has yet exceeded a duration of one-hundredth of a second?
§ Viscount DavidsonNo, my Lords.
§ Lord TordoffMy Lords, would the Minister not agree that it is perfectly normal in multinational organisations for different rates to be paid to different nationalities working on the same project?
§ Viscount DavidsonYes, my Lords.
Lord Bruce of DoningtonMy Lords, in view of the importance that Her Majesty's Government have previously attributed to this project, will the noble Viscount give the House an assurance that when the EC Commission budget for 1987 comes up for consideration Her Majesty's Government will fully support the restoration of cuts made in the JET project and will do their very best to ensure that it receives the utmost encouragement not only from the EC as a whole but from the United Kingdom?
§ Viscount DavidsonMy Lords, I can assure the noble Lord that the JET project gets the utmost support from the British Government.
§ Lord Orr-EwingMy Lords, can my noble friend say whether the people working on this ambitious, essential and very much to be encouraged project are paid free of tax or do they pay the tax of the countries from which they come? How is this administered so that there is some justice between one worker and another?
§ Viscount DavidsonMy Lords, I am afraid I cannot answer that question, but I will write to my noble friend. I ought to tell the House the UKAEA staff assigned to JET were told that they would remain authority employees on authority terms and conditions while engaged on the project. The JET undertaking has a limited life and the UKAEA employees have, of course, a right of return to the authority.
§ Lord IronsideMy Lords, when the late Lord Hinton and I visited the joint research centre at Eastborough to look at the issue of siting the JET project in this country, little did we expect that there would be different conditions of employment between the European members and our own people. But we found that the issue centred on the—
§ Lord Ironside—setting up of a European school for the education of the children of Community employees. This was done by the government of noble Lords opposite. I should like to ask my noble friend whether the UKAEA employees working at JET qualify to send their children to the European school.
§ Viscount DavidsonMy Lords, that, I am afraid, is a question to which I do not have the answer, but I shall write to the noble Lord.
§ Lord BeswickMy Lords, does the noble Viscount not remember that we had a great struggle to get this joint European project in this country and that the argument which we then put forward was that British scientists were ahead of all the others? Is it not quite intolerable that they should be paid half the rate? Although the noble Lord on the Liberal Benches may be right, and there is often a difference between the pay of one nationality and another, it is not such a difference. I ask the noble Viscount whether something more is not to be done.
§ Viscount DavidsonMy Lords, the employees of the UKAEA took the matter to the European Court, which took account of all the factors and decided, as I said, that the existing arrangements are to be upheld.
Earl FerrersMy Lords, what kind of thermometer reads a temperature of 140 million degrees centigrade without melting?
§ Viscount DavidsonMy Lords, I should think a rather large one.