HL Deb 08 July 1987 vol 488 cc675-7

3.5 p.m.

Lord Jenkins of Putney

My Lords, I beg leave to ask the Question standing in my name on the Order Paper.

The Question was as follows:

To ask Her Majesty's Government whether they will intervene in the application by the Royal Opera House for permission to develop Covent Garden, and hold a public inquiry into the proposals.

Lord Hesketh

My Lords, we have already given very careful consideration to calling in this application and holding a public inquiry, but have concluded that we would not be justified in taking the decision out of the hands of the local planning authority. Westminster City Council's planning committee have since resolved in principle to grant planning permission and listed building consent subject to the resolution of a number of outstanding detailed matters and completion of an associated legal agreement.

Lord Jenkins of Putney

My Lords, I am grateful to the noble Lord for that reply, but I am sorry that he has been told to give it to me in that form. Is he not aware that if ever there was a case for a public inquiry this is it? Is he aware that expert opinion on both sides differs between whether this is the best thing that can be done on the one hand and a total disaster on the other? Moreover, is he aware that when I was Minister for the Arts I warmly welcomed the idea of this land being provided to the Arts Council so that it could supervise the matter? Also, is he aware that the Arts Council have handed it over to the Trustees of the Royal Opera House in circumstances which, I am informed, are challengeable in the courts? Is he aware that this decision of great national importance was taken by nine votes to six on the planning committee of the Westminster City Council? This is a very serious matter. Will he not ask his right honourable friend to take another look at it?

Lord Hesketh

My Lords, the land was bought out of public funds and given to the Arts Council in 1975 for the ultimate benefit of the Opera House. It is held on trust by the Arts Council and the Royal Opera House jointly. If it is not developed the net proceeds of sale will be returned to the Arts Council to the ultimate benefit of the Exchequer.

Lord Broxbourne

My Lords, does not my noble friend consider that the question may be drafted with rather less than the felicity of language usually employed by the noble Lord, Lord Jenkins of Putney? Does not the word "intervene" suggest an exceptional and possibly an autocratic procedure? Is it not a fact that there is statutory provision for what in the jargon of these matters is called the call-in procedure? Would this not be an appropriate case for that in view of the cultural and planning—

Lord Denham

Speech!

Lord Broxbourne

Does my noble friend the Chief Patronage Secretary want to interrupt me? He is very welcome.

Lord Denham

Order!

Lord Broxbourne

My Lords, I congratulate him on his prudence in remaining seated.

Lord Hesketh

My Lords, the Government's general approach is to intervene as rarely as possible in planning responsibilities of local authorities.

Lord Strabolgi

My Lords, are the Government aware that one of the problems is that they insist on a mix between the Opera House's development and commercial development? Will they not reconsider this and be a little more generous towards our national Opera House? Then a lot of these problems would disappear.

Lord Hesketh

My Lords, the Government have undertaken to maintain the funding of the arts in real terms, and are doing so. But art demand increases all the time. It is a penalty of success. Supply cannot meet this demand. In particular it is just not possible to fund every capital project. The Royal Opera House has to be commended on the enterprise it is showing in using its assets to fund as necessary rebuilding, which will, however, still require very sizeable private donations.

Lord Jenkins of Putney

My Lords, is the noble Lord aware that I am very happy to accept the change in wording proposed by his noble friend if the result of that is that he accepts the proposal put to him by his noble friend, that his right honourable friend shall call in this matter again? In my simple and ungrammatical way that is precisely what I was seeking to bring about.

Finally, if he is telling us that his right honourable friend is not prepared to look at this again—I hope that we do not have to accept that—will he say that with regard to the conditions which will be laid down he will make sure that the work on the Opera House will be given priority and that no other building shall take place prior to the handing over of the full value of that land to the Royal Opera House trustees?

Lord Hesketh

My Lords, it is still possible for my right honourable friend to intervene. Westminster planning committee resolved to grant planning permission subject to negotiating a legal settlement. Until this has been satisfactorily concluded and the planning permission issued it is still possible for the Secretary of State to intervene. However, as I have already indicated, we do not consider that such a course would be justified.

Lord Jenkins of Putney

My Lords, I am most grateful to the noble Lord for that answer. Is he aware that I shall put forward further reasons why his right honourable friend should intervene?