Gibraltar (Hansard, 19 February 1987)

HL Deb 19 February 1987 vol 484 cc1201-2 1201

§ Lord Boyd-Carpenter
My Lords, I beg leave to ask the Question standing in my name on the Order Paper.

§ The Question was as follows:

§ To ask Her Majesty's Government whether the conversations in January between the Foreign and Commonwealth Secretary and the Spanish Foreign Minister resulted in decisions by Spain to withdraw the Spanish military guard on the Gibraltar frontier and to withdraw the ban on the use of Spanish airspace by British military aircraft approaching or leaving Gibraltar airport.

§ The Minister of State, Foreign and Commonwealth Office (Baroness Young)
My Lords, no, although both issues were raised by my right honourable and learned friend. We shall continue to pursue these matters with the Spanish authorities.

§ Lord Boyd-Carpenter
My Lords, I thank my noble friend for that reply. Will she say whether the Spanish Foreign Minister during the discussions when this matter was raised gave any explanation whatever of the unfriendly conduct which both these matters represent by a fellow member of NATO and the EC?

§ Baroness Young
My Lords, these matters were discussed with the Spanish authorities. We entirely take the point made by my noble friend, but we no longer think it appropriate to have a military guard at the frontier between two Community partners and NATO allies. We very much hope that the Spanish authorities will take the same view.

§ Lord Cledwyn of Penrhos
My Lords, it has been reported that some measure of agreement was reached between the Foreign and Commonwealth Secretary and the Spanish Foreign Minister on the use of Gibraltar airport by Spanish citizens. Will the Minister say to what extent that is true? Perhaps I may take the supplementary question of the noble Lord a step further and ask whether it is possible that Her Majesty's Government might discuss with our partners in the European Community their participation and co-operation in order to achieve a settlement as regards Gibraltar?

§ Baroness Young
My Lords, the use of the airport is one of the matters which is currently being discussed between ourselves and the Spanish Government. We have not yet come to any conclusions, although we should like to make progress on this, as we should on other matters.

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§ Lord Mellish
My Lords, is the Minister aware of the fact, and does she take it into account, that the vast majority of the people who live in Gibraltar express the desire to remain under British control? Is that to be completely ignored?

§ Baroness Young
My Lords, on the contrary, we have made our position absolutely plain. We stand by the preamble to the 1969 constitution.

§ Lord Kennet
My Lords, will the Government agree that this difference between two members of the European Community poses a certain historical political difficulty on one side, and that the governments are animated by the maximum good will towards each other? Therefore it behoves the parliaments of both countries to play it very cool.

§ Baroness Young
My Lords, I am sure that it is valuable that parliamentarians from both the British and Spanish Parliaments should meet to discuss these matters. They may come to a greater understanding of each other's viewpoints.

§ Lord Boyd-Carpenter
My Lords, is my noble friend aware that, uncharacteristically, she did not answer the question I asked as to what explanation the Spanish Foreign Minister gave for his country's attitude to this matter, other than perhaps that it was in breach of the Tenth Commandment?

§ Baroness Young
My Lords, it is always difficult for a British Minister to speak on behalf of another government as regards their views. However, I am quite sure that if my noble friend, who is so wise on so many matters, reflects upon this he will no doubt see that the Spanish authorities also have their political difficulties over the matter.

§ Lord Caccia
My Lords, will the noble Baroness also agree that it is rather sad to see a once proud, and rightly proud, nation behaving in what can only appear as such a petty manner?

§ Baroness Young
My Lords, yes. We very much hope that these matters of the ceremonial guard and the use of the air space will be resolved. That would create an atmosphere of greater confidence, which would be helpful.