International Terrorism and Economic Sanctions (Hansard, 22 January 1986)

§ Lord Chalfont
My Lords, I beg leave to ask the Question standing in my name on the Order Paper.

§ The Minister of State, Foreign and Commonwealth Office (Baroness Young)
My Lords, our experience is that economic sanctions are not effective. We do not consider them the right response to states that are alleged to be harbouring or sponsoring international terrorists.

§ Lord Chalfont
My Lords, I thank the noble Baroness the Minister for that reply. Given the constant increase in the rate of terrorism and the effects of it, will she not agree that it will be very little use defending ourselves against acts of terrorism unless we do something about those nations which sponsor and harbour international terrorists, and which are proved to have done so? This is not a question of alleged sponsors; this has been demonstrated and it has been proved that they are sponsors. If the noble Baroness thinks that economic sanctions are not effective—and I have seen no clear evidence of that in other contexts—what measures does she suggest that we should bring to bear on states which sponsor international terrorism in order to prevent them from doing so?

§ Baroness Young
My Lords, I should like to make it quite clear that we have condemned all acts of terrorism from whatever quarter and will continue to work with other like-minded countries to bring both political and diplomatic pressure to bear on states which support terrorists. As the noble Lord will be aware, we have tightened security, and there are now armed police at Heathrow, which I think indicates the seriousness with which we view the problem. We also encourage a full exchange of information and intelligence with others on terrorist activities, and we also monitor the movement and actions of would-be terrorists and those who support them.

§ Lord Cledwyn of Penhros
My Lords, with regard to the position in South Africa, and following the decision taken at the Commonwealth Conference in the Bahamas, can the noble Baroness say whether Her Majesty's Government have now reached a conclusion as to the action they will take if all the Commonwealth partners decide to take economic sanctions against South Africa?

§ Baroness Young
My Lords, I think that at this stage that is a hypothetical question. The Government's position on the question of sanctions against South Africa is well known.

§ Lord Orr-Ewing
My Lords, in the face of the first supplementary question by the noble Lord, Lord Chalfont, will my noble friend not consider whether we should be doing something more positive to discourage not only those who harbour but those who actually train terrorists and who proudly boast that they are doing exactly that? If we cannot bring about effective general sanctions, can we not bring oil sanctions to bear particularly on countries like Libya? 235 Would not that be particularly appropriate at the present time when the oil supplies for the whole world are pretty buoyant and therefore there is no abject need to crawl to Libya and buy their supplies of oil?

§ Baroness Young
My Lords, to answer my noble friend, we have taken a number of actions against Libya. Following the shooting of the policewoman in St. James's Square in 1984, we broke off diplomatic relations; we prohibited the export of defence equipment; we denied ECGD cover for medium and long-term credit and we imposed severe restrictions on Libyan immigration into Britain.
I should also like to make it clear that we shall continue to work actively with the United States and other like-minded countries to bring pressure to bear on those countries which support terrorism. My right honourable and learned friend the Foreign and Commonwealth Secretary has made that clear, as I did when I was in Washington 10 days ago.

§ Lord Glenamara
My Lords, would the noble Baroness care to express a view on the effectiveness of the recent economic sanctions imposed by South Africa on Lesotho?

§ Baroness Young
My Lords, I think that that question is quite wide of the Question on the Order Paper.

§ Lord Grimond
My Lords, does not the attitude of the Americans themselves show that this is not a very easy question, and would it not greatly help in the laudable aim of containing terrorism if the Americans would cease to harbour IRA terrorists and would take steps to prevent the raising of large sums of money in America for the support of the IRA?

§ Baroness Young
My Lords, I think we all agree that this is a very serious matter indeed, but I must make plain that the opposition of the United States Administration to the PIRA is well known and it is not policy to harbour IRA terrorists. Indeed, a supplementary extradition treaty has been concluded with the United States Administration which, if approved by the Senate, will prevent fugitive terrorists from avoiding extradition by claiming that their alleged offences were political.

§ Lord Molloy
My Lords, is the noble Baroness aware of the grave consternation expressed in British newspapers and in newspapers of the United States of America about the behavour of the CIA (which is an official part of American policy) in Nicaragua and other parts of southern America, which is also a form of terrorism? Should we not make representations about that as well as making representations about what has been happening to our people in this country as a result of IRA activities?

§ Baroness Young
My Lords, I think that the noble Lord's question is quite wide of the orginal Question on the Order Paper, but let me make it quite plain that the United States Administration have not asked us to join with them in imposing sanctions on Nicaragua.

§ Lord Elystan-Morgan
My Lords, will the noble Baroness not agree that in the long term there is a very strong case for a deep concept of collective security in this realm, in that any act of terrorism should be seen as an attack not just upon the victim country but upon all the law-abiding and peace-abiding countries of the world?

§ Baroness Young
My Lords, I accept what lies behind the noble Lord's question, as I entirely accept the concern expressed in the orginal Question by the noble Lord, Lord Chalfont. Indeed, the Foreign Ministers of the European Community will be meeting next week, and one of the subjects on their agenda will be terrorism, and it underlines our belief that is must be tackled by like-minded states working together.

§ Lord Hatch of Lusby
My Lords, does the noble Baroness agree that the actions of the South African Government in invading and killing nationals of the neighbouring states of South Africa, including those within the Commonwealth, is indeed international terrorism? If so, will her Government impose the same kind of sanctions on the South African Government that she has listed to the House this afternoon have been imposed on the government of Libya?

§ Baroness Young
My Lords, the noble Lord, Lord Hatch, is well aware of the steps that Her Majesty's Government have taken towards South Africa and the agreements that we have reached with our Community partners and indeed with our colleagues in the Commonwealth. We still believe that sanctions in that situation would be counter-productive, and we prefer positive measures such as the Commonwealth Eminent Persons' Group.

§ Lord Chalfont
My Lords, I wonder whether it would be in order to return to the Question on the Order Paper? Would the Minister agree that the danger of further massive acts of terrorism, possibly directed against the people of this country, is very real? The trend shows that this is likely to recur and become more severe in nature. In the light of that, will the Minister assure us that the Government will keep an open mind about any kind of riposte which is made against states which sponsor, harbour and train terrorists, and that they will not be too rigid in their attitude towards economic sanctions?

§ Baroness Young
My Lords, I should like to make it clear that wherever there is evidence of support for terrorists by a foreign government we do not hesitate to make clear our condemnation and take the necessary steps to deter and, if possible, stop such support. I have already indicated the firm measures that we took after the shooting in St. James's Square, and we believe that it is quite unacceptable for other countries to export violence to the United Kingdom or to other countries.