Public Buildings: Energy Conservation (Hansard, 5 February 1986)

Lord Campbell of Croy
My Lords, I beg leave to ask the Question standing in my name on the Order Paper.

§ Lord Brabazon of Tara
My Lords, one of the aims of the Government during Energy Efficiency Year 1986 is to bring about improved energy efficiency in public buildings. Energy managers are being appointed throughout the Government estate and the rest of the public sector, and their task is to keep energy consumption within standards appropriate to the buildings for which they are responsible. They will pay attention to heating control systems, and—like everyone else—will be governed by the provisions of the Fuel and Electricity (Heating) (Control) (Amendment) Order 1980.

Lord Campbell of Croy
My Lords, I thank my noble friend for that satisfactory reply. Will the Government do all that may be necessary to dispel any idea that an apparent surplus of crude oil internationally, and now a reduction in world prices of crude oil, make any conservation of this kind less necessary?

§ Lord Brabazon of Tara
My Lords, we are indeed doing our best through Energy Efficiency Year to make that point as clear as possible, and my noble friend may have seen the estimates that some £7 billion a year could be saved in energy consumption.

§ Lord Somers
My Lords, in view of the weather forecast, is this not rather an inappropriate time to have asked this Question? Would the noble Lord agree that sometimes the temperature in your Lordships' Chamber falls a little below what is desirable?

§ Lord Brabazon of Tara
My Lords, I understand that this building is the responsibility of the Property Services Agency. There is in fact an energy efficiency officer (I think that is the designation) with responsibility for the building, and I must sympathise with him because I cannot believe that he can have an easy job to do in this building.

§ Lord Broxbourne
My Lords, further to the point raised by the noble Lord, Lord Somers, will my noble friend, perhaps, when his attention can be spared from loftier concerns, give some consideration to the temperature of the writing room of this House? Can something be done about that so as to alleviate the distresss and discomfort involved and possibly even increase the efficiency of those under-privileged Members of this House who have no personal accommodation of their own?

§ Lord Brabazon of Tara
My Lords, I think the best that I can say to my noble friend is that I shall certainly draw his remarks to the attention of the appropriate authority.

§ Lord Stoddart of Swindon
My Lords, would the noble Lord agree that this is a really serious and difficult problem, in that people's heating needs in fact differ and the ideal is that heating arrangements should be adequate, comfortable and, indeed, controlled? I very much agree with what the noble Lord said in his reply to his noble friend Lord Campbell of Croy, but can he say whether the Government policy of restricting local government expenditure, and indeed central government expenditure, is preventing the installation of modern heating systems with up-to-date, efficient, control systems?

§ Lord Brabazon of Tara
No, my Lords, so far as energy conservation is concerned, local authorities obtain considerable assistance from the department. I believe that the amount of money that could be saved by local authorities is estimated to be in the region of £135 million a year as calculated by the Audit Commission. Through the Audit Commission we have helped local authorities to develop guidelines and train their auditors in energy value-for-money audit. We have designed a special monitoring and targeting programme for them, and by the end of this year virtually all local authorities in England and Wales will have their energy use assessed against proper yardsticks.

§ Lord Stoddart of Swindon
My Lords, I really do thank the noble Lord for that answer. Will he pay some attention to the fact that many local authorities seem to be under the impression that if they use capital resources in improving heating they will have to reduce capital expenditure on other services? There seems to be that point of view in local authorities.

§ Lord Brabazon of Tara
My Lords, I do not have an answer to that particular question at the moment, but I shall look into it and perhaps write to the noble Lord.

§ Lord Tordoff
My Lords, can the noble Lord tell us whether the Government are taking steps to prevent people from getting overheated in another place?

§ Lord Brabazon of Tara
My Lords, I do not think that is a question for me to answer in this Chamber.

Lord Campbell of Croy
My Lords, is my noble friend aware that, unwittingly, some recent questions of mine seem to be leading to improvements in the comfort of your Lordships? Does my noble friend agree that an oppressively overheated room or hall in a building owned or administered by central government is not only a waste of energy but a very bad example to others?

§ Lord Brabazon of Tara
My Lords, I certainly agree with everything that my noble friend has said.

§ Viscount Massereene and Ferrard
My Lords, does my noble friend also agree that it tends towards making quite a few of us catch bad colds? While I do not have one at the moment, that certainly is one result.

§ Lord Brabazon of Tara
My Lords, my noble friend may well be right, but I am not a doctor.