Central European Time (Hansard, 6 March 1985)

§ Viscount Mountgarret
My Lords, I beg leave to ask the Question standing in my name on the Order Paper.

§ Baroness Trumpington
My Lords, my noble friend's suggestion would give more hours of daylight on spring and autumn afternoons, but it would also mean longer hours of darkness in the mornings in late autumn and winter. The Government do not believe that this would be acceptable to the public generally.

§ Viscount Mountgarret
My Lords, is my noble friend aware (I having given her advance notice of my supplementary question in order to make life easier for her) that even by early February it is light by seven o'clock in the morning but dark at half-past four in the afternoon; that such a move would be of great advantage to the building trade in particular and to any firm or persons engaged in business with their counterparts in the Common Market and in Europe, not least financial institutions—

Noble Lords
Reading!

§ Viscount Mountgarret
—and that for most people the earlier end to long dark evenings would be welcome? Lastly, what, pray, might the permanent difference in time actually cost?

§ Baroness Trumpington
My Lords, in answer to the last part of my noble friend's three-part supplementary question, it is quite impossible for me to give the cost in London. However, those who work in the City have no trouble in contacting their European counterparts, and changing to summer time would certainly have no effect on telephonic communication with such countries as the USA and Japan. As for the suggestion that extended summer time would be welcomed by particular groups or industries, successive Governments have seen the present arrangements as probably the best compromise between those who prefer light mornings and those who prefer light evenings.
With regard to that part of my noble friend's supplementary question dealing with making life easier for those who have business or financial dealings with our European partners, if summer time were to extend from February to November we in Britain 1311 would be one hour behind Europe from April to September; there would be no time difference in October and November; we would again be one hour behind in December and January; there would be no time difference in the two months February and March; we would lose the benefit of a harmonised starting date for summer time, and it would cause absolute confusion for the international transport industry.

§ Lord Mishcon
My Lords, does the noble Baroness the Minister recollect a debate which took place on this very subject, initiated by her noble friend, on 24th October last year, when my noble friend Lord Stoddart made an interesting and amusing speech and the noble Baroness the Minister made an interesting and serious speech? Was it not then raised as a matter of importance that there had been many more Post Office workers' accidents when we had an extension of summer time, and did the noble Baroness not then inform the House most usefully that there would be more fuel consumed as a result of that extension, her information coming from the Central Electricity Generating Board?

§ Baroness Trumpington
My Lords, I am most grateful to the noble Lord who by his supplementary question has prevented me from repeating the many answers that I gave on 24th October.

§ Lord Shinwell
My Lords, may I ask the noble Baroness whether it is not true that anything extra that we import from Europe costs us more money?

§ Lord Harvington
My Lords, is it not a fact that if this idea were adopted it would be extremely difficult for the milk industry and very wasteful of effort, and would be altogether a bad thing for British agriculture?

§ Baroness Trumpington
My Lords, I think that it particularly applies to those who keep cattle, because cows' milking times are not elastic.

Lady Saltoun
My Lords, will the Government bear in mind that when British summer time was tried in Scotland on an experimental basis all the year round in the early 'seventies it proved extremely unpopular?

§ Baroness Trumpington
Yes, my Lords, I am aware of that. When the end of that experimental time came, the vote in another place showed how unpopular that experiment had been.

§ The Earl of Kimberley
My Lords, does my noble friend agree that for too long the decision on summer time has been based on the effect on cows and the time that they like to be milked, and also on the effect on our friends across the Border in the north? Quite honestly, the population of England is extremely large and I am sure that if a ballot were taken it would show that most people would like to be able to go out after they get home from their office on evenings in the month of March.

§ Baroness Trumpington
My Lords, the Government have absolutely no wish to dictate to anybody in 1312 regard to this matter, but I would refer to my last answer to the noble Lady. When this subject was debated in another place there was a massive majority of 366 votes to 81 against the proposal, and this must surely reflect public opinion.

Lord Wallace of Coslany
My Lords, is the noble Baroness aware that extended working hours during daylight might at this very moment be very acceptable to another place?

§ Baroness Trumpington
My Lords, I think the noble Lord has a point.

§ Lord Elwyn-Jones
My Lords, does the noble Baroness's answer mean that the Government are determined to keep the public in the dark?

§ Baroness Trumpington
No, my Lords. The Government believe in eternal light.

Viscount St. Davids
My Lords, nobles the noble Baroness agree, in view of the considerable confusion which appears to reign on this matter, that it might be valuable to have a Gallup Poll on it, while presumably not allowing the cows a vote?