HL Deb 14 January 1985 vol 458 cc775-6

3.6 p.m.

Lord Murton of Lindisfarne

My Lords, I beg leave to ask the Question standing in my name on the Order Paper.

The Question was as follows:

To ask Her Majesty's Government when they propose to amend the Civil Defence Act 1948 to enable civil defence funds to be used in safeguarding against peacetime emergencies as well as against hostile attacks, as promised in the Conservative manifesto 1983 (page 43).

The Minister of State, Home Office (Lord Elton)

My Lords, it remains this Government's intention to implement our manifesto commitment by promoting suitable amending legislation at the earliest practicable opportunity.

Lord Murton of Lindisfarne

My Lords, in thanking my noble friend the Minister for his reply—which, to a great extent, I had already anticipated—may I ask whether he would not agree that this is an important matter? In addition to the assurance that he has given, can he give a further assurance that the legislation which we hope to see will come forward during the next Session of Parliament?

Lord Elton

My Lords, my noble friend knows that we would be glad to take an offer from a Private Member to take such a Bill. I might remind him that during the last Session of Parliament we had enacted five Private Member's Bills on Home Office material alone, two of them in fulfilment of manifesto commitments.

Lord Renton

My Lords, is my noble friend aware that peace-time emergencies are occurring on an ever-increasing scale and that the people responsible for dealing with them are also responsible for civil defence? Is he further aware that to leave this important matter to the uncertainties of Private Members' legislation in both Houses is an evasion by the Government of their own responsibility?

Lord Elton

My Lords, I am indeed aware of the considerable and very effective work being done by the emergency services under the law as it now stands. I accept that this is nonetheless an important matter and I would remind my noble friend that both the Juries (Disqualification) Bill (which he will remember, and in which he played an important part) and the Video Recordings Bill were enacted in the first Session of this Parliament in fulfilment of party manifesto undertakings and that there are a number of Sessions ahead of us yet.

Baroness Vickers

My Lords, may I ask the noble Lord the Minister whether he will tell me how many local authorities have actually produced plans for both these objects?

Lord Elton

My Lords, I am not sure what are both the objects that my noble friend suggests.

Baroness Vickers

My Lords, I refer to the two in the Question: peacetime emergencies and hostile attacks.

Lord Elton

My Lords, I think that I cannot reply to that without notice.

Lord Boyd-Carpenter

My Lords, in considering the question of legislation, will my noble friend and the Government bear in mind that legislation to do what is asked for in this Question would not be likely to be controversial and therefore would be very unlikely to take much parliamentary time? Will he not represent to his colleagues the point that this is a good thing which ought to be done promptly?

Lord Elton

My Lords, of course, I shall pass on my noble friend's observation to my right honourable friend; but the description that he gives of the measure makes it very suitable for a Private Member's Bill.

The Earl of Lauderdale

My Lords, is my noble friend aware that the proliferation of so-called nuclear-free zones and of local authorities failing to carry out their duties to provide civil defence exposes large parts of the population to the hazard of other disasters as well; and this needs to be dealt with?

Lord Elton

My Lords, I do not think that the proliferation of nuclear-free zones would have a great deal of effect on the attempts of any hostile power to attack us; but in so far as my noble friend has drawn attention to another aspect of things I shall pass on his views.

Lord Bruce of Donington

My Lords, for the record, can the noble Lord confirm to the House that all the commitments contained in the Conservative Party's 1983 manifesto are still fully operative?

Lord Elton

My Lords, if the noble Lord wishes to widen the substance of this debate he should put down another Question.