HL Deb 02 April 1985 vol 462 cc117-9

2.43 p.m.

Baroness Masham of Ilton

My Lords, I beg leave to ask the Question standing in my name on the Order Paper.

The Question was as follows:

To ask Her Majesty's Government whether they will make it possible for the NHS to import German artificial limbs for NHS patients.

The Earl of Caithness

My Lords, we have set up an independent working party, under the chairmanship of Professor Ian McColl, to review the services provided through artificial limb and appliance centres in England. We expect that its report will indicate any advantage there might be from the wider provision of artificial limbs and components made overseas.

Baroness Masham of Ilton

My Lords, I thank the Minister for that reply. Is he aware that some of the sockets made in Germany out of soft plastics relieve pain, and would he therefore not agree that a little competition within the market is a good thing?

The Earl of Caithness

My Lords, I am aware of the point concerning, sockets which relieve pain. British sockets relieve pain equally as well as German sockets. Yes, I think that competition is healthy.

Baroness Lockwood

My Lords, is the Minister aware that it is widely felt that the socketry skills in German artificial limb-making are superior to British skills? Since pain from an ill-fitting socket is one of the greatest difficulties which wearers of artificial limbs have to overcome, does the Minister not think that this matter is one of some urgency? Is he aware also that German artificial limbs are available under the National Health Service in Scotland and Northern Ireland but apparently not in England?

The Earl of Caithness

My Lords, in answer to the noble Baroness's first point, yes, some sockets can be ill-fitting, but this is probably due to wrong alignment and wrong fitting in the first place. We are taking steps to correct this in this country.

Lord Wells-Pestell

My Lords, is it not a mistake to have a committee merely to look into what is available in England without at the same time exploring what is available—which may be better—in other countries?

The Earl of Caithness

My Lords, I believe I am right in saying that the committee can consider a number of matters, including the wider provision of artificial limbs and components made overseas.

Lord Ennals

My Lords, while welcoming the reference made by the noble Earl to the establishment of the working party, I support the point made by my noble friend Lord Wells-Pestell, that the working party should consider every form of artificial limb. Will the noble Earl confirm that there are no difficulties about the importation of these particular devices from Germany? Will he confirm also the point made in an earlier Question, that these same artificial limbs from Germany are provided under the National Health Service in Scotland? Would it not be wrong to discriminate against England and Wales in this respect? Finally—

Lord Denham

No, my Lords. Too long!

Lord Ennals

Finally, my Lords, and without any disrespect to contractors such as Hangers, does the noble Earl not agree that it is most important to provide the best possible service, the most comfortable service, to those who have been disadvantaged by losing their limbs?

The Earl of Caithness

My Lords, I agree with the noble Lord that we should provide the best fitting service, and that is why arrangements are in hand to establish a prosthetic training school at Roehampton. It is due to open in May of this year. As to the importation of artificial limbs, a company operating from a member state of the European Community should meet no obstacles to selling its products in this country which British manufacturers do not experience.

Baroness Masham of Ilton

My Lords, is the Minister aware that we are a very big exporting nation in this field? If our products are as well made as possible, then might we not be able to export even more?

The Earl of Caithness

My Lords, it is to be hoped that that will be the case.

Lord Rugby

My Lords, may I ask the Minister if it is not the case that the Germans plastics industry is more advanced than our own? They may have a better plastic for this particular application. Perhaps that is something that could be looked into, because their artificial limbs do offer a better fit and are more comfortable than those produced in this country.

The Earl of Caithness

My Lords, I will pass on the noble Lord's remarks.