HL Deb 26 March 1984 vol 450 cc1-3
Lord Gainford

My Lords, I beg leave to ask the Question standing in my name on the Order Paper.

The Question was as follows: To ask Her Majesty's Government how many people are likely to have received educational opportunities by 1986–87 through the recently-announced scheme for unemployed adults.

The Earl of Swinton

My Lords, the programme will seek to improve educational provision for unemployed adults largely by providing advice and information about the most effective ways of meeting their varied needs. Some innovative and developmental provision will be sponsored, but responsibility for ensuring adequate educational provision for unemployed adults will continue to rest with local education authorities. While the Government hope that many students will benefit from the programme, it is not possible to identify them separately and to provide estimates of numbers.

Lord Gainford

My Lords, I thank my noble friend for that Answer. Has he any estimates of how certain areas where traditional industries have had to suffer practically from closure will be assisted by this scheme?

The Earl of Swinton

My Lords, we do not collect statistical information on unemployed students in further and adult education, but the indications are that participation by the unemployed is substantial. Some adult education centres in areas of high unemployment estimate that 20 per cent. or more of their students are without work. This programme will provide much useful information on this situation.

Lord Leatherland

My Lords, can the noble Earl tell us whether under this scheme the unemployed will be taught how to find jobs, since the Government do not seem to be doing very much about it?

The Earl of Swinton

My Lords, this Government, just as much as Members on the other side of the House, would like to see all the unemployed in jobs, and our economic policies are designed to secure that lasting recovery which alone can make the jobs available. Meanwhile, the unemployed can be helped by education in various ways, not least in terms of improving their employability.

Baroness Lockwood

My Lords, can the noble Earl the Minister tell us whether the scheme will be confined to vocational education or whether it will include the wider elements of education which perhaps would help people to come to terms with the new economic circumstances in which we are living?

The Earl of Swinton

My Lords, this involves both the DES and the MSC, and their interests in this field are complementary. For instance, the MSC are not concerned with non-vocational education while the DES programme will not focus on job-specific training. Between these poles there is an area where interests overlap. I am satisfied that the DES programme will establish its own identity, and this is why, in order to ensure fruitful collaboration, the MSC are represented on the DES Programmes Steering Committee. I am sure that this will help in both types of education.

Baroness Gardner of Parkes

My Lords, could the Minister confirm that in some areas unemployment is largely a matter of mismatch between skills and jobs, and that these educational opportunities may help people in this respect?

The Earl of Swinton

My Lords, they would help in that sort of case.

Lord Paget of Northampton

My Lords, can the noble Earl say what is the point of improving the employability of people for whom the Government have manifestly no intention of providing employment?

The Earl of Swinton

My Lords, I should have thought that the more employable they were, the more chance they would have of finding a job.

Lord Paget of Northampton

My Lords, not unless there is a job.

Baroness David

My Lords, would the Minister agree that the 125,000 unemployed which the Training for Jobs White Paper said will be helped will make a very small impression on the three million unemployed, since they represent only about 4 per cent.? Are there no other plans? Is more money going to the universities, and possibly to Birkbeck College, which deals with adult education?

The Earl of Swinton

My Lords, I think that one of the reasons for the setting up of this steering committee is to investigate what is happening and to see where the money can be spent for the greatest benefit and in the most cost-effective way.

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