HL Deb 26 April 1984 vol 451 cc203-5

7.12 p.m.

The Lord Advocate (Lord Mackay of Clashfern)

My Lords, I beg to move that the House do now resolve itself into Committee (on Recommitment) on this Bill.

Moved, That the House do now resolve itself into Committee (on Recommitment).—(Lord Mackay of Clashfern.)

On Question, Motion agreed to.

House in Committee (on Recommitment) accordingly.

[The LORD AYLESTONE in the Chair.]

Clause 1 agreed to.

Clause 2 [Exceptions to section 1]:

Lord Mackay of Clashfern moved Amendment No. 1:

Page 1, line 21, leave out from ("establishment") to the end of paragraph (b).

The noble and learned Lord said: I beg to move Amendment No. 1, and at the same time I should like to speak to Amendment No. 3.

Amendment No. 3: Page 11, line 25, leave out ("this Act") and insert ("the Social Work (Scotland) Act 1968").

Clause 2(2)(b) derives from Section 2(3)(b) of the Children Act 1958 as amended by Schedule 8 to the Social Work (Scotland) Act 1968. Clause 21(1) of the Bill defines "residential establishment". This definition in fact derives from the definition of "residential establishment" in Section 94(1) of the 1968 Act. and is in the same terms. It is accordingly not necessary to refer expressly to the 1968 Act in Clause 2(2)(b). The amendment gives effect to this, and Amendment No. 3 is consequential.

I may perhaps say to your Lordships that this amendment and Amendment No. 3—indeed, all the other amendments that I shall move this evening—have been approved by the noble and learned Lord, Lord Brightman, as the chairman of the Joint Committee on Consolidation Bills. I beg to move.

On Question, amendment agreed to.

Lord Mackay of Clashfern moved Amendment No. 2:

Page 2, line 27, leave out from ("Act") to end of subsection (4) and insert ("1984")

The noble and learned Lord said: I beg to move Amendment No. 2, and at the same time I should like to speak to Amendment No. 5.

Amendment No. 5: Page 14, line 23, at end insert—

(" Reference to Mental Health (Scotland) Act 1984

8. If at the commencment of this Act the Mental Health (Scotland) Act 1984 is not in force, then, until that Act is in force, section 2(4) shall have effect as if for the reference to "1984" there were substituted a reference to "1960".")

Clause 2(4) derives from Section 2(4) of the Children Act 1958 as amended by Schedule 4 to the Mental Health (Scotland) Act 1960. The words, residential home for persons suffering from mental disorder

were defined in Section 19(2) of the 1960 Act. This section was repealed by Schedule 9 to the Social Work (Scotland) Act 1968. This repeal impliedly repealed the amendment made by the 1960 Act in Section 2(4) of the 1958 Act. It follows that the words inserted in that section by the amendment can now be omitted. The proposed amendment to Clause 2(4) of the Bill gives effect to this.

The amendment also substitutes for a reference to the 1960 Act a reference to the 1984 Act. This is a reference to the current consolidation. In the event of this Bill coming into force before the mental health consolidation, Amendment No. 5 makes an appropri-ate transitional provision. I beg to move.

Lord McCluskey

I should like to make a few comments on Amendment No. 5, which is being taken along with Amendment No. 2. I wonder whether it is really necessary to do it in this fashion. This is a consolidation Bill, and, therefore, one would hope that when it becomes a statute one can look at the statute and find all the law as it then is on the day of the enactment. But the curious provision in Schedule 1 that: If at the commencement of this Act the Mental Health (Scotland) Act 1984 is not in force, then, et cetera, means that one simply cannot tell by looking at the provision whether or not it is in force. I wonder whether it is not possible so to run the two Bills together that one does not have to have this kind of provision and one just has a reference to the 1984 Act. Surely one ought to be able to arrange them in the parliamentary timetable so that one does not have the kind of "if provision that this Bill contains.

Lord Mackay of Clashfern

Unfortunately, it is not easy to be certain how the parliamentary timetable will operate. In order to be strictly accurate about it, I fear that this amendment is necessary. Indeed, there is a convention, of which the noble and learned Lord, Lord McCluskey, will be aware, that it is not normal to refer in a Bill of this kind to a Bill which has not yet had its Second Reading in the second House. But if consolidations are to operate reasonably accurately and effectively, I think it is necessary in this case to make this provision. As I have said, all of these amendments have been approved by the noble and learned Lord. Lord Brightman, as chairman of the Joint Committee, and as far as I can see it is necessary for strict accuracy to do that. As matters stand at the moment, the Mental Health (Scotland) Act 1984 is not yet in force.

On Question, amendment agreed to.

Clause 2, as amended, agreed to.

Clauses 3 to 20 agreed to.

Clause 21 [Interpretation]:

Lord Mackay of Clashfern moved Amendment No. 3:

[Printed above.]

The noble and learned Lord said: I have sought to explain this amendment already. I beg to move.

On Question, amendment agreed to.

Clause 21, as amended, agreed to.

Clause 22 agreed to.

Clause 23 [Citation etc.]:

Lord Mackay of Clashfern moved Amendment No. 4:

Page 12, line 24, leave out ("6") and insert ("8")

The noble and learned Lord said: This is a purely drafting amendment to correct a typographical error. I beg to move.

On Question, amendment agreed to.

Clause 23, as amended, agreed to.

Schedule 1 [Transitional provisions]:

Lord Mackay of Clashfern moved Amendment No. 5:

[Printed earlier.]

The noble and learned Lord said: I have already sought to explain this amendment. I beg to move.

On Question, amendment agreed to.

Schedule 1, as amended, agreed to.

Remaining schedules agreed to.

House resumed: Bill reported with the amendments.

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