HL Deb 25 April 1983 vol 441 cc717-8
Lord Braye

My Lords, I beg leave to ask the Question standing in my name on the Order paper.

The Question was as follows:

To ask Her Majesty's Government whether it is now possible to discuss reductions of fares on the short haul flights to the Continent from the United Kingdom.

Lord Lyell

My Lords, any reduction in the level of air fares is in the first place a matter for the commercial judgment of the airlines. However, we have for some time past played a leading role in discussions within the European Community to develop measures which would give the airlines greater freedom to follow their own judgment and to introduce new or lower types of fare. We also do our best to support fares initiatives by British airlines through bilateral discussions with the individual Governments concerned. Progress has been slow but I can assure my noble friend that we will continue to press the matter.

Lord Braye

My Lords, may I thank the noble Lord for is very kind Answer. I do hope the Government will be able to open some discusssions now on this matter. The difference or variation in air fares at the moment is completely out of proportion.

Noble Lords

Question!

Lord Braye

My Lords, I suppose it is, yes,

Lord Lyell

My Lords, I have some sympathy for my noble friend's questions; and, indeed, he is quite correct in suggesting that air fares on many of the European routes are very much out of proportion. The Government have been loooking at the "on demand" fares for the longer European routes and in particular for those services to Italy, Greece and Scandinavia.

Lord Orr-Ewing

My Lords, can my noble friend do rather more than look at these fares? The British nation and other nations have put up for a very long time with swingeing fares on short hauls to places such as Stockholm and Denmark—even to France and elsewhere. It has been rather left to private people, sometimes using their own money, to campaign for greater fairness and for greater value for money regarding EEC air fares. Would it not be a good idea if the Government, instead of looking at it, took the initiative in trying to introduce fares which were more reasonable compared with world air fares?

Lord Lyell

My Lords, it is of course for the Government to do what they can to help; but I am sure that my noble friend of all people is aware, together with many of your Lordships, that neither the Government nor the Civil Aviation Authority have powers to require airlines to reduce their fares. Secondly, even if this were possible, it would still be open to Governments at the other end of particular routes in any particular case to block the reductions.

My noble friend will no doubt be aware that the terms of our international agreements enable us to refuse increases in fares where these are not justified. I would also tell my noble friend that I have personal experience of appalling fares. It cost me three times more than it normally costs to get back from Geneva yesterday—that is an area of particular concern to my noble friend, with all his sporting connections.

Baroness Burton of Coventry

My Lords, as this has gone on for years, and while accepting that both British Airways and the Government have done their best on this particular matter, would the noble Lord—or, in other words, the Government—feel able to have a look at the fares which are offered by the bucket shops and the other bureaux in London? Could they present a paper on the wide variations in fares to Europe offered by these agencies?

Lord Lyell

My Lords, of course we shall look at this. We are very grateful to the noble Baroness for that information, since she is a mine of information on most of the fares all round the world. However, certainly I could give no commitment on producing a paper.

Lord Beswick

My Lords, I wonder whether the noble Lord can tell the House how it is that if all these airlines are charging so much money—all of them over-charging, is the allegation—they all contrive to be making such big losses!

Lord Lyell

My Lords, the noble Lord will certainly be aware that the British Government take the lead in encouraging more competitive air fares in Europe as well as in the rest of the world. The noble Lord will be interested to know that we held back from any action on requiring reductions in existing fares in 1982 because of the extremely heavy losses which were sustained by airlines throughout the world.

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