Human Fertilisation Inquiry (Hansard, 22 November 1982)

Lady Saltoun
My Lords, I beg leave to ask the Question which stands in my name on the Order Paper.

§ The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Department of Health and Social Security (Lord Trefgarne)
My Lords, while recognising the concern that many feel about this subject, the Government believe it is essential that proper consideration be given to the extremely important matters which this inquiry was set up to examine. Evidence has been sought from well over 200 organisations and, in our opinion, it would be unrealistic to expect the inquiry to consider this volume of evidence and prepare a full report in less than 18 months.

Lady Saltoun
My Lords, I thank the noble Lord for that reply. In view of the fact that the matter is of some considerable urgency, would the Government consider making additional resources and staff available to the committee to enable them possibly to report earlier? Secondly, in view of the fact that the press release announcing the setting up of the committee stated, quite clearly, that religious viewpoints would be represented on that committee, would the Government agree either that the composition of the committee is unsatisfactory, or that the press release was misleading?

§ Lord Trefgarne
My Lords, I doubt whether increased secretarial resources would enable the committee to give more thorough consideration to this 712 matter more quickly, as the noble Lady suggests. As for the representation of the various religious faiths on the committee, it is not the intention that individual members of the committee should represent any particular religious persuasion. However, there are members of the Moslem faith, of the Church of England, of the Jewish faith, of the Church of Scotland and of the Roman Catholic faith; and there is, indeed, the wife of a right reverend Prelate of your Lordships' House on the committee. So I do not think that that particular viewpoint will go by default.

§ Baroness Gaitskell
My Lords, I wonder whether the Minister would be kind enough to explain this Question to me. I do not understand what it means and I should be very glad if he would explain. It is the first time that I have come across such a Question with regard to men and women—or men.

§ Lord Trefgarne
My Lords, without wishing to be flippant in reply—this is, of course, a very serious subject—perhaps I can best help the noble Baroness by saying that the main thrust of the work which the inquiry is concerned with relates to achieving viable pregnancies in women who would otherwise not be able to do so.

§ The Earl of Lauderdale
My Lords, in view of the Orwellian 1984 perspectives raised by this Question, would my noble friend agree that there is an urgency about getting an informed basis for public debate? Would he consider the possibility that the committee might be invited to issue some sort of preliminary report, because, at present, debates and newspaper articles are pretty wild and pretty frightening?

§ Lord Trefgarne
My Lords, I think that a preliminary report could be achieved only by skimping over the evidence that has been received, and by hastily reaching conclusions on it, which I do not think would be the right way to proceed in this matter. As I said in the first Answer, we have asked a large number of groups to give us their views. We have asked for those views by the end of next March, and clearly, the committee cannot be expected to consider all the evidence in detail before then. I do not think that the time we envisage after next March for them to consider the evidence and produce the report is unreasonable, and I do not think it could be properly hastened.

The Earl of Halsbury
My Lords, the period of gestation of this committee being double the length of time for the gestation of the individuals into whom it is inquiring, is it not acceptable that they should be split up into couples and take evidence in parallel? That is the way of accelerating the work of the committee—not more secretariat.

§ Lord Trefgarne
My Lords, as I said, the evidence will come from a wide range of different groups, and the various members of the panel who are considering this evidence will, I think, want to consider all the evidence and not just some of it.

§ Lord Cledwyn of Penrhos
My Lords, I note that all religious persuasions seem to be represented on this committee, except the Free Churches of this country. Why is that?

§ Lord Trefgarne
My Lords, as I said earlier, no religious persuasion is represented on the committee, but I was asked about the viewpoints of various members who are on the committee and I gave the answer. The fact is, of course, that all the Churches will be asked to give evidence to the committee. I have a list in front of me of no fewer than 39 various religious bodies, including all the Free Churches, and they will be asked to give evidence in due course.

§ Lord Cledwyn of Penrhos
But, my Lords, if the Anglicans, the Catholics, the Mohammedans—

§ The Earl of Lauderdale
The Church of Scotland.

§ Lord Cledwyn of Penrhos
—and the Jewish community are represented, why are the Free Churches not represented on this committee; or, even if not represented, why is there no Free Churchman on the committee?

§ Lord Trefgarne
My Lords, as I said, no member of the committe is particularly representing the Church of which he happens to be a member. The members are there because of their particular expertise in these matters, which may not particularly be a religious expertise. But the views of all the Churches will certainly be taken into account.

§ Lord Kinnaird
My Lords, in view of what the Minister has said, can he tell us if, meanwhile, the Church is giving us any lead on these matters?

§ Lord Trefgarne
My Lords, I suspect that that is not a question for me.

Lady Saltoun
My Lords, since I hope that this committee will investigate not only what some noble Lords have said, but also genetic engineering and experiments on foetuses, would the Government find it possible to suggest to the medical profession that, pending the report of the committee, they should call a halt in experimentation in the meantime?

§ Lord Trefgarne
My Lords, as I said just now in answer to another question, the main purpose of these inquiries relates to the promotion of viable pregnancies in women who could not otherwise achieve them. This surely is thoroughly laudable and something which should be encouraged and assisted by all possible means. I recognise that there is some anxiety about research going beyond that. Your Lordships may have seen the guidelines put out last week by the Medical Research Council which will greatly assist in these matters.