HL Deb 22 July 1982 vol 433 cc967-70
Lord Auckland

My Lords, I beg leave to ask the Question which stands in my name on the Order Paper.

The Question was as follows:

To ask Her Majesty's Government what proposals they currently have in mind to assist the hotel industry, especially in tourist areas.

Lord Lyell

My Lords, the Government are already assisting the hotel industry by encouraging the development of tourism. This year some £56 million is being provided through the statutory tourist boards for promotional and project support.

Lord Auckland

My Lords, may I thank my noble friend for his Answer. But is he aware that for the past 18 months or so I have had a "No Day Named" Motion on the Order Paper, and this is a kind of hors-d'oeuvre in the hopes of a fuller debate in the future? May I ask my noble friend two supplementary questions: First, could he comment on the relationships and discussions between the various tourist boards and the hotel industry, particularly in development areas; and does he think there is sufficient rapport here? Secondly, with regard to the Hotel and Catering Industries Training Board, can my noble friend say what advice is being given to school-leavers and others as to the advantages of the catering and hotel industry in this country, and they are many, bearing in mind that British cookery and catering is very often second to none?

Lord Lyell

My Lords, of course your Lordships will be aware of, and do not need my noble friend nor indeed the Government to reiterate, the primacy of British cookery, especially as it is exhibited day by day in your Lordships' House—or, I should say, consumed. My brief answer to both my noble friend's questions is that, yes, indeed, the Government are aware of the great contribution which the catering and hotel industry can make to British tourism, especially in development areas. My noble friend and the House will be aware that financial assistance to the catering and hotel industry in development areas is part of a much wider view of taxation and fiscal arrangements which are currently under discussion by my right honourable friend the Chancellor of the Exchequer. In reply to my noble friend's other supplementary question, the tourism and catering industries are a major source of employment and support throughout the country, and especially in development areas.

Lord Mackie of Benshie

My Lords, is the noble Lord the Minister aware that the bulk of tourists come from this country to the Highlands and other tourist parts of Britain, and that the greatest help he could give would be to persuade his right honourable friends to reduce the interest rate to stimulate the economy?

Lord Lyell

My Lords, we do, of course, appreciate that tourism makes a very substantial contribution to the economy in various parts of the country—and nowhere more than in my own part of the world and that of my neighbour, which is Scotland. My right honourable friend is doing everything that he can to assist this particular industry, but there are competing claims and other industries for my right honourable friend's attention.

Lord Glenkinglas

My Lords, will my noble friend bear in mind, following the question from the noble Lord, Lord Mackie of Benshie, that in my part of the West of Scotland, 90 per cent. of the tourists come from the South by car, and that the biggest disincentive is not interest rates but the price of petrol, which is almost entirely under the control of the Government?

Lord Lyell

My Lords, I will indeed hear that very important point in mind. I am sure your Lordships will be aware that my noble friend is not entirely cut off since the developments of the weekend and that now at last we do have alternative forms of transport to Scotland. But he is quite correct in saying that, in his particular part of the world, motor transport is the most important form of arrival and departure.

Lord Nugent of Guildford

My Lords, is my noble friend the Minister aware that the University of Surrey has a faculty of hotel catering which is an extremely popular one and the only one in the country? Is he further aware that the Government's recent financial cuts dealt to Surrey were to the tune of some 25 per cent? Is he aware that, if he wants to see hotel and catering trades encouraged by further training for undergraduates to become graduates in this important activity, it would be wise to be a little more liberal with finance to the only university that has a faculty for this subject?

Lord Lyell

My Lords, I shall certainly bear in mind the comments of my noble friend Lord Nugent of Guildford, but I am sure that he and your Lordships will bear in mind, also, that the Hotel and Catering Industry Training Board, and indeed the industry in general, are aware of the constant need to provide training opportunities which will help convince school-leavers and indeed graduates that worthwhile careers in hotels and catering exist, and, we hope, will continue to exist and increase.

Lord Lloyd of Kilgerran

My Lords, I do not wish to introduce an acrid atmosphere of international competition in regard to the tourist trade. But will the noble Lord the Minister bear in mind the interests of Wales? Quite apart from the development areas, there are very attractive areas in Wales where the tourist trade need any assistance that they can get from the Government.

Lord Lyell

My Lords, I shall of course bear in mind the eloquent words, as always, of the noble Lord, Lord Lloyd of Kilgerran.

Lord Inglewood

My Lords, is my noble friend aware that, at this time, when hotel receipts like those of many other industries are tending to fall, there is understandable fear in the industry that the review of the development areas, of which my noble friend has spoken, will result in large parts of this country, where the tourist and hotel industry is important, being excluded from the help they have had over recent years?

Lord Lyell

Yes, my Lords, but may I stress to my noble friend and your Lordships that the Government have decided that Section 4 Assistance under the Development of Tourism Act 1969 should be available countrywide, so that support for tourist projects should be based on considerations directly related to the needs of tourism as such. I would stress also that detailed arrangements for the future operation of this scheme are still being considered, and we shall announce them as soon as possible.

Lord Belhaven and Stenton

My Lords, is my noble friend prepared to do anything about the proliferation of tourist boards, which I mentioned in this House about nine months ago? Is he aware that, when kept a small hotel in the Hebrides, I had to deal with four tourist boards? Is this not rather a waste of money and Government paper? Could not the number of tourist boards dealing with various areas of the United Kingdom be cut and therefore money be saved for other purposes?

Lord Lyell

My Lords, I was not aware of my noble friend's Question of the recent past. The only statutory tourist boards referred to in my original Answer were the English, Scottish, Welsh and, of course, British Tourist Boards. If I missed any, and if my noble friend can help me, perhaps we can discuss this later over a bottle of the excellent beverage which I understand comes from the island where my noble friend used to reside and to keep an hotel.

Several noble Lords

Next Question!

Lord Hatch of Lusby

My Lords—

Lord Mancroft

My Lords, as a previous president of the London Tourist Board, may I ask my noble friend the Minister whether he is aware that there is a growing concern that there are too many tourist boards in this country and that the question of my noble friend Lord Belhaven and Stenton has a real power behind it, and that the time has come for the Government to look at the number of tourist boards in this country? I have declared my interests. Ought we not to tidy up the situation a little for the genuine benefit of tourism throughout the entire country?

Lord Lyell

My Lords, my noble friend, as always, is extremely eloquent. He is this time even more correct, and I will bear in mind his comments. I am very grateful for them.

Lord Ponsonby of Shulbrede

My Lords, the noble Lord is no doubt aware that the Parliamentary Under-Secretary, Mr. Sproat, is currently carrying out an investigation into the question of the responsibilities of the individual statutory tourist boards.

Lord Lyell

My Lords, indeed my honourable friend is at the moment carrying out an investigation, but I am afraid I could not pre-empt what he might have to say. If the noble Lord would keep in touch with me, I can inform him as to how these discussions are proceeding.

Lord Hatch of Lusby

My Lords, in his concern for the hotel industry—

Several noble Lords

Next Question!

The Minister of State, Ministry of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food (Earl Ferrers)

My Lords, the noble Lord, Lord Hatch, has been trying to ask a question. I think the general tenor is that we should move on to the next Question. Perhaps if the noble Lord will ask his question we can move on after that.

Lord Hatch of Lusby

My Lords, I am greatly obliged to the noble Earl. In his concern for the hotel industry, is the noble Lord keeping himself informed as to the number of international chains of hotels, mainly based in the United States of America, that tend to undermine and take the place of the traditional British hotel industry? Is he aware that this is a worldwide problem and one that we could well do without?

Lord Lyell

My Lords, I would disagree with the noble Lord in his question, in so far as he believes that any improvement, or any increase in hotel development and the hotel industry in the United Kingdom is in any way harmful. I am sure the noble Lord and your Lordships would appreciate that any foreign- or overseas-based chain or group in an industry which sought to undermine—those were the noble Lord's words, not mine—British traditions of good hospitality and catering, would, I believe, be doomed to failure.

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