HL Deb 19 January 1982 vol 426 cc519-21

2.47 p.m.

The Earl of Cork and Orrery

My Lords, I beg leave to ask the Question which stands in my name on the Order Paper.

The Question was as follows:

To ask Her Majesty's Government on what evidence the Advisory Committee on Airports Policy stated, in its report of 21st November 1979 (paragraph 5.16), that, for the purposes of a gateway international airport at Severnside, "a new motorway crossing the Severn, together with a 10-mile link to the M4 motorway would be required from the outset".

Lord Trefgarne

My Lords, as the Advisory Committee on Airports Policy made clear in its report, its assessment of the surface access requirement of the Severnside site was based on similar criteria to those adopted by the Study Group on South East Airports in its consideration of sites nearer to London. I understand that the committee's conclusions were based on advice by those of its members with expertise in this area, which included the Department of Transport.

The Earl of Cork and Orrery

My Lords, I am obliged to my noble friend for that Answer, I suppose, but I did ask him on what evidence they based their statement. He did not mention any evidence in his Answer. May I ask him therefore whether he is aware that on 19th October last year, in reply to a Question from Mr. Abse in another place, the Minister for Trade stated that no member of the committee had in fact visited the site, so that nobody had taken any evidence on the ground? Is he further aware that a glance at a map will show that the distance from the motorway to the edge of the airport site as proposed is just about 1¼ miles? If one extends the distance, which is referred to in the committee's report as 10 miles, to the nearest intersection on a motorway—a very labour-saving device and a very under-used intersection, No. 23—it is found to be about 1½ miles. What reliance can we therefore place on anything else in this report?

Lord Trefgarne

My Lords, my noble friend—as I fear he has done in connection with this matter on earlier occasions—has over-simplified the problems to which he refers. The problems of access to the Severnside airport are quite considerable, including the one referred to in his Question and my Answer. As for the source of the evidence to which he has referred, as I believe I have made clear already, the evidence was to be found in the views of the members of the study group.

Lord Nugent of Guildford

My Lords, is my noble friend aware that I was a member of the advisory committee and must therefore declare an interest? Is he aware that, when assessing the merits of the Severnside site, one of the major factors was obviously access to London, to which a very large number of international air travellers would be wishing to go? Therefore, this was one of the factors that we had to look at and it was given very careful consideration. Perhaps my noble friend can answer one other question. Is he aware that the site has certain problems of altitude? Can my noble friend tell me whether the site would stand up to the flooding difficulties of the present time?

Lord Trefgarne

My Lords, my noble friend has raised an interesting point. I believe that if the airport were in existence now it would have suffered very considerably from the recent flooding in that part of the world.

The Earl of Cork and Orrery

My Lords, may I ask my noble friend whether he is aware that the Thames-Severn estuary is in fact tidal and that the site of the airport which we are discussing, lying as it does wholly below high water mark, is in fact flooded twice a day?

Lord Trefgarne

My Lords, I think the airlines had better be warned to fit floats.