HL Deb 24 June 1980 vol 410 cc1469-71

2.37 p.m.

Lord BROCKWAY

My Lords, I beg leave to ask the Question which stands in my name on the Order Paper.

The Question was as follows:

To ask Her Majesty's Government what proposals the Hong Kong Government have made for reconstruction of the urban council for Hong Kong and Kowloon.

Lord TREFGARNE

My Lords, on 6th June the Hong Kong Government published a Green Paper entitled A Pattern of District Administration in Hong Kong. Copies have been placed in the Library of the House, together with a summary of the proposals. Although the Paper deals primarily with district administration there are some consequential proposals for the urban council, including the reservation of seats for council members on district boards, an increase in elected and appointed membership and the introduction of adult suffrage.

Lord BROCKWAY

My Lords, while welcoming the extension of the franchise which previously was restricted on educational and professional grounds, I should like to ask two questions. First, in view of the responsible way in which the elected members have fulfilled their duties on the urban council under the inspiration of Elsie Elliot, why are half the members still to be nominated by the Governor? Secondly, are there any proposals to extend the functions of the urban council, which are now almost entirely restricted, to health, recreational and cultural amenities?

Lord TREFGARNE

My Lords, the functions of the council are a little wider than the noble Lord suggests. However, we do not propose—or at least it is not proposed under this document—to extend them further because of the need, as we see it, to maintain the efficiency of central Government throughout the territory. As for the ratio of elected and appointed members to the council, there is a need, as we see it, to maintain a wide range of experience on the council and we think that the present arrangements are working very well.

Lord GORONWY-ROBERTS

My Lords, is the noble Lord-in-Waiting aware that we on this side of the House would support what my noble friend Lord Brockway has said as regards the general intention of the extension of elective democracy in the Crown Colony? We support him because he is always impeccable as well as implacable on these matters. Is he further aware that we are equally concerned that the Governor and the Government of Hong Kong—and equally the Government of the United Kingdom—should constantly bear in mind what the Chinese community in Hong Kong desire and what the authorities in Peking would deem to be generally in the interests of Hong Kong and, indeed, of themselves in this matter?

Lord TREFGARNE

My Lords, I am not able to comment on the views of the Government in Peking on this matter. We are not aware of those views. How- ever, as regards the extension of the electoral arrangements, these proposals do, of course, provide for such an extension in the new territories.

Lord BROCKWAY

My Lords, will the Government take a longer view of this matter? Is it not the case that before many years have passed China will probably take over Hong Kong? Would it not be an excellent example to Communist China if we had full democracy in Hong Kong not only in the urban council but by the establishment of a legislative assembly?

Lord TREFGARNE

My Lords, I know of no basis for the assertion that China will take over Hong Kong. The lease has many years to run, and in any event I imagine that the arrangements will be renegotiated long before it expires.

Lord LEE of NEWTON

My Lords, in view of the great change of attitude of the Peking Government, does the noble Lord agree that they may be looking at the position of Hong Kong in the longer term and that they will agree to a greater amount of election rather than appointment of the council?

Lord TREFGARNE

My Lords, as I have said, I cannot forecast what attitude the Peking Government will take in this matter. But it is certainly the case that China derives a good deal of benefit from the existence of Hong Kong in its present form.

Lord SEGAL

My Lords, does not Hong Kong as it is today already present an excellent example for Communist China and any other territory in the Far East to follow?

Lord TREFGARNE

My Lords, I am not quite sure to what sort of example the noble Lord is referring, but certainly it is a splendid example of the free enterprise system at its best.