§ 2.50 p.m.
§ Lord HATCH of LUSBYMy Lords, I beg leave to ask the Question which stands in my name on the Order Paper.
§ The Question was as follows:
§ To ask Her Majesty's Government what success they have achieved in persuading their allies to contribute to the aid fund for Zimbabwe.
§ The LORD PRESIDENT of the COUNCIL (Lord Soames)My Lords, no general aid fund for Zimbabwe has been established. We have been active in urging all friendly donors to provide generous aid for Zimbabwe, and will continue so to do. The results so far have been somewhat disappointing. However, some donors have made only initial pledges for immediate reconstruction, and others have yet to make known their intentions. In addition to bilateral pledges, a number of international agencies will be starting programmes in Zimbabwe.
§ Lord HATCH of LUSBYMy Lords, is the noble Lord aware that according to a recent survey four out of five Zimbabweans are facing famine in the next few months unless something drastic is done in the immediate future? Is he also aware that the previous régime in Zimbabwe had estimated that it would require £600 million of development money to offset the effects of the war? As the last reply I received from the Government on this matter indicated that they were trying to mobilise resources from our allies, could the noble Lord be a little more forthcoming as to what is to be done in this emergency situation?
§ Lord SOAMESMy Lords, I must say that this is the first I have heard of figures anything like those which the noble Lord has just mentioned in terms of starvation, and I do not think that they at all tally with the facts in Zimbabwe. There is a considerable distribution problem owing to the communications having been very disrupted during the war, but it is much more that than anything else. There are certain areas which the food is not reaching, but the situation has nothing 1486 like the character, so far as I am aware—and I hope I am right—inferred in the first part of the noble Lord's supplementary question.
As to the second part of his supplementary, our offer of £75 million was over a three-year period. Taking what we think is likely to be spent by Zimbabwe in the first year, both from ourselves and from other donors, it comes to between £60 million and £70 million—of that sort of order. Over a three to four-year programme, there will be much more needed than has already been decided upon, as it were, by us and our friends; but we are hopeful, as I say, that others will be more forthcoming. In particular, there is to be an aid donors' conference (and we have offered every help we can to the Zimbabwean Government to get this off the ground) which will be held in Salisbury, hopefully, before the end of this year, and we hope that this will be the moment when other countries will be forthcoming. So far as we are concerned, not only have we offered the £75 million, which, at present, is among the highest that we are giving to any country in Africa this year, but on top of that we have waived over £20 million of Government debt. So I do not think that we have done other than set a good example, and it is our fervent hope that others will follow it.
Lord PAGET of NORTHAMPTONMy Lords, could some indication be given that, in this and in other matters affecting Zimbabwe, Her Majesty's Government must be influenced by the attitude of the Zimbabwean Government towards the administration of law by due process, and are taking particular interest in what is happening with regard to the prosecution of those whom the police may consider guilty of a particularly atrocious murder of a white farmer near Salisbury, I think, two days ago?
§ Lord SOAMESMy Lords, I find it a little hard to answer that question because, as the noble Lord rightly said, this is something which occurred yesterday or the day before, I think, and is obviously, in the nature of things, sub judice.
§ Lord GORONWY-ROBERTSMy Lords, is the Minister in a position to indicate the approximate date of the 1487 proposed Salisbury donors' conference; and could he—I am sure he could—give an assurance that the United States in particular will be effectively represented at such a conference in view of the fact that very early on they came forward with very generous proposals as to their own role in a joint donation to the new state? Is the noble Lord aware that we are all most understanding of certain contemporary preoccupations in the United States, but the world's preoccupation with what is happening in Southern and Central Africa should perhaps take precedence, even over internal American politics?
§ Lord SOAMESMy Lords, I sympathise very much with what the noble Lord, Lord Goronwy-Roberts, has said, and it is our hope that the contemporary and temporary preoccupations will have passed before the aid donors' conference comes into being.
§ Lord HATCH of LUSBYMy Lords, may I ask the noble Lord a further supplementary question of which I have given his office notice? Would he agree that one of the aspects of aid which we can give to Zimbabwe is help in training their young people to take over the various positions of responsibility in that country; and, in that connection, could he tell the House what is the present position of the two young ladies, Miss Nkala and Miss Tshuma, who apparently were refused entry to this country when they came here in order to further their education?
§ Lord SOAMESMy Lords, I find myself in some difficulty here, in that the noble Lord was kind enough to give me notice that he intended to ask this question. On the other hand, as Leader of the House I must say that this question about two specific young ladies and what happened to them when they came into England seems to me to be rather far from the original Question about what success they have achieved in persuading their allies to contribute to the aid fund for Zimbabwe. However, since notice was given, I perhaps might do my best to answer the noble Lord's supplementary question, which is that when these two young ladies came into this country they were not given leave to enter on the grounds that they had no evidence of 1488 acceptance for a course of studies; and despite representations which were made to Her Majesty's Government following on this by Members of another place, Ministers have confirmed this to be the case.
§ Lord HATCH of LUSBYBut, my Lords, is it the Government's intention to deport these two young ladies tomorrow, as I understand, according to reports, is the present position?
§ Lord SOAMESMy Lords, if they are refused entry, they will have to go back to Zimbabwe.