§ 2.40 p.m.
§ Lord BROCKWAYMy Lords, I beg leave to ask the Question which stands in my name on the Order Paper.
§ The Question was as follows:
§ To ask Her Majesty's Government what conclusions were reached at the meeting of the United Nations Security Council on 31st March when Palestinian self-determination was discussed; and how the national representatives, including those of the United Kingdom, voted.
§ The SECRETARY of STATE for FOREIGN and COMMONWEALTH AFFAIRS (Lord Carrington)My Lords, the Security Council's deliberations on Palestinian rights are continuing. We have made clear that we would regard a vote on a resolution at this stage as untimely and unlikely to contribute to the achievement of a comprehensive settlement.
§ Lord BROCKWAYMy Lords, is it not the case that the amended resolution would have guaranteed security, territorial integrity and political independence of all States in the area, which would have included Israel? Was not the addition an affirmation that the Palestinian people have the right to self-determination including, if they choose, an independent State? Is not security for Israel and Palestinian self-determination the policy of this country?
§ Lord CARRINGTONMy Lords, the noble Lord is quite right. The draft which we have seen would certainly cause the Government several difficulties.
Lord JANNERMy Lords, may I ask the noble Lord whether, if there is created next door to Israel a State which is controlled by the PLO—as it must be—he does not consider that there will be terriffic violence, and that Israel cannot possibly believe that it will be secure in 5 circumstances such as those? Will the noble Lord please tell the United Nations and our friends in the EEC that none of them would be prepared to have an enemy State, which was controlled by anarchists and murderers, right on their doorsteps?
§ Lord CARRINGTONMy Lords, I think that the noble Lord opposite is jumping to conclusions. I do not think that it necessarily follows that any State—if ever there were one—would necessarily be PLO or Moscow dominated.
§ Lord GORONWY-ROBERTSMy Lords, may I join the noble Lord in something he said in his reply? The settlement which he is seeking, and which was sought by previous Governments, must be comprehensive—otherwise it will neither be just nor durable. That brings in the fundamental question of relating the rights of the Palestinians to the undoubted rights of Israel.
§ Lord CARRINGTONYes, my Lords, I agree with the noble Lord in every particular.
Lord PAGET of NORTHAMPTONMy Lords, can we be assured that our representative, unlike his American colleague, knows when not to vote?
§ Lord CARRINGTONMy Lords, he had better!