HL Deb 20 November 1979 vol 403 cc4-5

2.53 p.m.

Lord ORR-EWING

My Lords, I beg leave to ask the Question which stands in my name on the Order Paper.

The Question was as follows:

To ask Her Majesty's Government what plans they have for allowing British Caledonian to develop their scheduled long-range network.

Lord TREFGARNE

My Lords, this is primarily a matter for British Caledonian, subject only to their ability to secure the necessary licences from the Civil Aviation Authority. The Government's role is limited in the main to the negotiation of international traffic rights to enable such licences to be exploited.

Lord ORR-EWING

My Lords, may I thank my noble friend for that Answer. Will he confirm that under the new Civil Aviation Bill, which had its Second Reading in another place yesterday, competition will be encouraged, and British flag carriers like British Caledonian will be free to apply to the Civil Aviation Authority for a licence to operate scheduled flights on these long-range routes?

Lord TREFGARNE

My Lords, Yes, indeed; under the Bill to which my noble friend referred the requirements for the Government to issue guidelines to the Civil Aviation Authority will be removed and it will thereafter be open to any carrier—including British Caledonian and British Airways—to apply to the authority for whatever licences they think they need.

The Earl of KIMBERLEY

My Lords, would my noble friend not agree that when Eagle and British Caledonian were allowed to operate in competition with British Airways on domestic routes the services improved out of all recognition? Would he not therefore agree that competition on the long-distance routes will probably have the same effect?

Lord TREFGARNE

My Lords, Yes, I do.

Lord CLIFFORD of CHUDLEIGH

My Lords, is it not a fact that when British Caledonian took over the South American run from British Airways, which they were running at a loss, within a year British Caledonian turned it into a profit? Should not British Caledonian now be encouraged to do the same thing elsewhere?

Lord TREFGARNE

My Lords, I have not the historical facts in front of me. It is certainly the case—at present anyway—that the South American routes operated by British Caledonian appear to be going very well.

Lord DRUMALBYN

In the last answer but one, did my noble friend imply that it was after the licence had been granted with the countries concerned that the Government would negotiate the necessary rights for those flights?

Lord TREFGARNE

My Lords, that is correct. Under the procedure that has been in being for a good many years, it is first of all the responsibility of the relevant authority—in this case the Civil Aviation Authority—to grant a licence. It then falls to the Government to obtain the necessary traffic rights under the appropriate bilateral agreement.