§ 3.40 p.m.
§ Baroness ELLESMy Lords, with the leave of the House, may I say that I regret that the wording of the Private Notice Question which I have asked is incorrect. The correct wording is as follows:
"To ask Her Majesty's Government whether following the rejection of his appeal against the death sentence by Mr. Zulfikar Ali Bhutto, they will recall Her Majesty's Ambassador in Islamabad for urgent consultations."
§ Lord GORONWY-ROBERTSThe Answer of my right honourable friend is as follows:
"The task of the Ambassador is to remain in Islamabad to represent at this crucial stage the views of Her Majesty's Government. Now that the Supreme Court decision has been made, and there is a provision for Presidential clemency, the Ambassador has today delivered a personal message from my right honourable friend the Prime Minister to President Zia. The Government hope he will find a way to temper justice with mercy."
My Lords, that is the Answer which has just been made in the other place by my right honourable friend.
§ Baroness ELLESMy Lords, I should like to thank the Minister for that reply to my Private Notice Question. While we do not wish to interfere in any way with the internal affairs of another country, nor, indeed, with the processes of their traditional system, yet we would ask the Government, as good friends of Pakistan, to convey to the Government of Pakistan our anxiety, which I believe is shared by all sides of your Lordships' House, that in considering this very sensitive case they should bear in mind the wider political implications of carrying out this death sentence. May I also ask whether the Government could make some intervention as to the conditions in which Mr. Bhutto is being kept in prison. There have been considerable Press reports as to these condtions. This may be something which at the same time the Government might be able to touch on in their message to the President of Pakistan.
§ Lord GLADWYNMy Lords, we on these Benches feel that presumably there would be general agreement with the proposition that, while we should not seek to interfere in any way with the judicial proceedings of another and, indeed, a friendly country, it would seem to be in the long-term interests of Pakistan herself that clemency should be exercised now in respect of any crimes that Mr. Bhutto may be judged to have committed.
§ Lord HAILSHAM of SAINT MARY-LEBONEMy Lords, as one who does not hold Mr. Bhutto's views at all, may I ask the Government whether I may be permitted to associate myself with these pleas. The quality of mercy is not one of which any man need be ashamed. Perhaps the Government will ask the Ambassador to remember that there is much about clemency in the Koran which General Zia might care to consider.
Lord HOME of the HIRSELMy Lords, may I associate myself with my noble friends and with the Minister. I am very glad that a message is being sent to the Pakistan Government. I think that we in this country and in this House can claim to be friends of Pakistan. We should like the leaders of Pakistan to know of our concern for the reputation of Pakistan should this sentence be carried out.
§ Lord GORONWY-ROBERTSMy Lords, on behalf of my right honourable friend and the Government, it only remains for me to say that I fully share the views and the tone in which those views were expressed by the noble Baroness and the three noble Lords who have intervened in this brief exchange. I particularly value the sensitivity with which the noble Baroness put the points which she made, a sensitivity to which everybody else who spoke contributed. We have no wish to interfere with the internal processes, justiciary or otherwise, of an independent country, one with whom we have a very firm friendship. I am sure that what has been said, and the way in which it has been said, in this House this afternoon will be so understood by the Pakistan Government and by the people of Pakistan, of all shades of opinion. I shall draw to his notice the point which the noble Baroness raised about perhaps adding to the message which my right honourable friend has sent. The noble Baroness and everybody else will wish that that message, which I imagine is now on its way to Pakistan, should not in any way be impaired as to its essential sensitivity and also its prospects of success.
§ Baroness LLEWELYN-DAVIES of HASTOEMy Lords, the other Statement has been cleared in the other place. I do not know whether the Opposition Benches are ready to take it now?
§ Lord HAILSHAM of SAINT MARY LEBONEMy Lords, I think we had better have it.