§ 11.8 a.m.
§ Lord BROCKWAYMy Lords, I beg leave to ask the Question which stands in my name on the Order Paper.
The Question was as follows:
To ask Her Majesty's Government whether they will prohibit the export from Britain of"high tar cigarettes to Third World and other countries.
Lord WALLACE of COSLANYMy Lords, the Government are deeply concerned about the effect of smoking on health, but they do not consider that unilateral action by the United Kingdom to prohibit the export of"high tar"cigarettes to Third World and other countries would serve any useful purpose. The trade would not stop, because there are many other sources of supply.
§ Lord BROCKWAYMy Lords, I thank the Minister. Is he not aware that British companies are seeking to compensate themselves for the loss of"high tar"cigarette sales in this country while exploiting the Third World? In many countries"high tar"content cigarettes are being sold at a higher rate than in this country—in Sri Lanka and Malaysia it is 61 per cent. higher, in Kenya 72 per cent. higher—and there is no health warning on the packet.
Lord WALLACE of COSLANYMy Lords, my noble friend is obviously quoting from the booklet issued by War on Want entitled Tomorrow's Epidemic,by Mike Muller. Several accusations are made in that book but, of course, I am not in a position to confirm or deny any of these accusations. That is a matter for other people to investigate. The United Kingdom has done what it could to encourage multilateral action to prohibit trade in"high tar"cigarettes. It has taken an active part in all the conferences organised by the World Health Organisation to discuss the dangers of smoking: and a further conference is planned for 1979. The agreement in this country is on a voluntary 1553 basis and it is not our policy to impose conditions on other countries which we do not impose on ourselves by law in this country.
§ Lord BROCKWAYMy Lords, may we hope that there will be some international action? Is it not the case that plantations in these territories are being established for tobacco growing, at the cost of food growing, where people are actually dying from hunger? Is the noble Lord aware that the Ministry of Overseas Development and the Development Corporation are helping to finance these plantations for cigarette tobacco? Would he draw the attention of the Ministry of Overseas Development, which am sure would be sympathetic, to this report which War on Want has issued?
Lord WALLACE of COSLANYMy Lords, strictly speaking, that is an entirely different question because it does not deal with export. On the other hand, I will certainly undertake, on behalf of my noble friend, to draw my honourable friend's attention to the question of overseas development.
§ Lord LUCAS of CHILWORTHMy Lords, may I ask the Minister what measures Her Majesty's Government are taking to promote the development of the substitute materials in lieu of tobacco?
Lord WALLACE of COSLANYMy Lords, I am quite at a loss to understand how this arises under the question of the export of "high tar" cigarettes. However, several attempts have been made in this country, but I rather gather that they are not successful.
§ Lord GISBOROUGHMy Lords, is the noble Lord aware that the great majority of cigarettes with British brand names sold overseas are not exported from this country and are, by agreement, made entirely by either America or other countries?
Lord WALLACE of COSLANYMy Lords, that is true. There are agreements for various tobacco companies—some of them British—to manufacture their products overseas in some of the countries. Of course, there is a point here about the economic position of various countries. 1554 This does give employment and one must take all these factors into account when discussing the problem.
§ Lord ORR-EWINGMy Lords, would the noble Lord not agree that these countries which have been mentioned are all self-governing, and it is up to them to set their standards for their own population, and it is not for us to lecture them on what is right and wrong in a self-governing economy?
Lord WALLACE of COSLANYMy Lords, that may be so, but our position is that we can set an example and give advice in world conferences. However, the final decision—we must face this, my Lords—must be made by the countries concerned. I believe that some development is taking place in Malaysia. If that is so, that is at least a start. We can give an example.
§ Lord BROCKWAYMy Lords, would the noble Lord not agree that this is another instance of the unacceptable face of capitalism?