§ 2.38 p.m.
§ Lord ELTONMy Lords, I beg leave to ask the Question which stands in my name on the Order Paper.
§ The Question was as follows:
§ To ask Her Majesty's Government how the number of student teachers successfully completing training in each year and remaining unemployed after qualification are incorporated in the numbers of registered unemployed teachers.
Lord WALLACE of COSLANYMy Lords, I am informed by the Manpower Services Commission that the statistics for unemployment by occupation are based on the main occupation in which unemployed registrants are seeking work. Newly-qualified teachers seeking teaching posts may register with Professional and Executive Recruitment, a specialist branch of the Employment Service Agency. Those who remain registered with Professional and Executive Recruitment as unemployed are incorporated in the total of all unemployed registrants seeking 533 teaching posts as published by the Department of Employment. This total figure is not broken down by date or year of qualification.
§ Lord ELTONMy Lords, while thanking the noble Lord for that reply, may I ask him how it comes about that in a Press release published by the Department of Education and Science on 12th May, the break-down of numbers of registered unemployed teachers in September last year was given as 7,187, but in the same release it is stated that of those teachers who successfully completed training last summer—a different category from those registered as unemployed, says the Department—about 10,300 were still seeking teaching jobs in October? Should those figures not be amalgamated?
Lord WALLACE of COSLANYMy Lords, the official figures available include not only newly-trained teachers who have registered for teaching posts but also trained teachers either seeking further employment or coming back into the profession. I think the difference is accounted for by a survey carried out by the University Council for the Education of Teachers on behalf of the National Association of Teachers in Further and Higher Education. That indicated that of the estimated 40,100 successfully completing courses of initial teacher training in England and Wales in 1976, about 10,300 were still seeking teaching posts last October. The latest figures, dated 10th March 1977, give a total—I can split it down for the noble Lord if required—of 7,447, of which 5,195 were seeking work as school teachers in England and Wales.
I would add that it is distinctly possible that, although students may successfully complete a course of teacher training, quite a number of them, probably looking to the prospects of the profession at the immediate moment, seek other employment. In fact only a fortnight ago I met such a lady who has now obtained a post with the Department of Social Services.
§ Lord ELTONMy Lords, may I ask the noble Lord for one further fragment of illumination? Am I to take it, then, that the figure of 7,187 unemployed teachers in September 1976 excluded 534 newly-qualified teachers, but the figure of 5,195 in March of this year had newly-qualified teachers added in?—because otherwise the figures would be entirely misleading.
Lord WALLACE of COSLANYNo, my Lords; the figure I gave of 7,447, which is the latest figure as at 10th March this year—a further figure will be available very shortly—included not only newly-qualified teachers but teachers already qualified either seeking further employment or coming back into the profession. The 5,195 related to England and Wales, as I have already said. The figure quoted by the noble Lord of 10,000-odd of course goes back to a survey carried out last October, and very shortly we should have official figures.
I would add—I will be frank about it—that this is a difficult Question to answer because it involves two Departments while I, thank heavens!am responsible for only one. But if there is any point on which clarification is needed I will certainly see that, between the two Departments, I get the answer for the noble Lord.