§ 2.42 p.m.
§ Lord FERRIERMy Lords, I beg leave to ask the Question which stands in my name on the Order Paper.
§ The Question was as follows:
§ To ask Her Majesty's Government whether they are satisfied that the BBC, by broadcasting "Today in Parliament" at the late hour of 11.30 p.m. is properly complying with the spirit of Clause 13(2) of its Licence and Agreement; whether their attention has been drawn to the fact that the BBC's Saturday programme "The Week in Westminster", hitherto broadcast at 9.30 a.m., is now timed at 11.2 a.m.; and whether these changes imply a reduction in the importance of their contents.
§ Lord WELLS-PESTELLMy Lords, the requirements laid on the BBC by its licence and agreement is to broadcast an impartial account day by day of Parliamentary proceedings in both Houses. The scheduling of programmes is a matter within the discretion of the Corporation. The BBC have informed me that the modifications in programme schedules to which the noble Lord has I drawn attention were introduced to produce a better pattern of programmes and do not in any way imply a diminution of their importance.
§ Lord FERRIERMy Lords, while thanking the noble Lord for his reply, is he aware that the programme at 11 o'clock is "A Book at Bedtime"? Does he agree with me that 11 o'clock might perhaps be a more acceptable time to the public for the broadcasting of 897 "Today in Parliament", and that "A Book at Bedtime" should be broadcast at 11.30 p.m.?
§ Lord WELLS-PESTELLMy Lords, if the noble Lord does not mind, I do not want to express an opinion on that; hut, as the noble Lord knows, a number of times have been tried and my understanding is that the reason for shifting if from the time previously in use to the present time, which I believe was done on 4th July, was that Parliament, and particularly another place, so often sits very late. The extra quarter hour enables the BBC to produce a fuller, in the sense of a more informed, account of the proceedings of the day. That is the reason I have been given for moving the programme to 11.30 p.m.
§ Lord GEORGE-BROWNMy Lords, will the noble Lord agree with me that, on most days, shifting the programme "Today in Parliament" to the place of "A Book at Bedtime" would mean that most listeners would hardly notice the difference?
§ Lord WELLS-PESTELLMy Lords, the noble Lord is an authority on those matters.
§ Lord TREFGARNEMy Lords, while not wishing to interfere with the very proper control exercised by the BBC over these matters, would the noble Lord suggest to them that they might like to broadcast an omnibus edition of "Today in Parliament" perhaps on a Sunday morning?
§ Lord WELLS-PESTELLMy Lords, there is a responsibility under the Charter of the BBC—and for that matter it applies to the IBA—that they must take into account not only public opinion but the opinion of Parliament on all matters relating to broadcasting. That is perhaps one of the useful things that this Question will serve to emphasise today.
§ Baroness GAITSKELLMy Lords, is the noble Lord aware that many of us would support the noble Lord, Lord Ferrier, about the Saturday programme, because that programme is mainly political and it is unfortunate that there is now a hiatus between the end of one political section and the beginning of another?
§ Lord WELLS-PESTELLMy Lords, all the expressions of opinion which have been given in your Lordships' House today will go to the BBC and, having regard to their obligations under the Charter, one would think that they would serve some useful purpose.
§ Lord MACKIE of BENSHIEMy Lords, does the Minister know by how much the audience is larger or smaller at the new times as compared with the old?
§ Lord WELLS-PESTELLI do not know, my Lords; I can only say that the broadcast of "Yesterday in Parliament" at 8.45 in the morning has a much larger audience, but I cannot answer the question in relation to the programme at night.
§ Lord FERRIERMy Lords, with reference to the noble Lord's reply to my supplementary question, I think I am right in saying that for many years "Today in Parliament" was broadcast at 10.45 p.m. Does the noble Lord recall that that hour was regarded as the latest possible, but it enabled "Today in Parliament" to record the result of 10 o'clock Divisions? The fact that "Today in Parliament" is getting later and later probably makes the rating to which the noble Lord has just referred even less than it was when the programme was broadcast at 10.45 p.m.
§ Lord WELLS-PESTELLMy Lords, it is perfectly true that some considerable time ago the time was 10.45 p.m., and then it was moved to 11.15 p.m. I can only repeat what I said earlier. It has been moved now to 11.30 p.m. in the hope of including more material or giving a better balance of the day's proceedings. But I will try to find out whether it has affected the rating and I will let noble Lords know.
§ Lord CROWTHER-HUNTMy Lords, is the Minister aware that the re-scheduling of programmes on Radio 4 by the BBC has resulted in a considerable reduction in the amount of time devoted to news and current affairs between the hours of 7 p.m. and 11.15 p.m., and can this be in the interests of the kind of programmes that the BBC should be broadcasting?
§ Lord WELLS-PESTELLMy Lords, my noble friend has made an interesting and, I am sure, a factual point and it is one of those I will certainly convey to the BBC.