§ Lord SHINWELLMy Lords, I beg leave to ask the Question which stands in my name on the Order Paper.
§ The Question was as follows:
§ To ask Her Majesty's Government whether the Prime Minister will consider making a broadcast urging young adult persons to associate themselves with various units of our auxiliary forces.
§ Lord WINTERBOTTOMMy Lords, there are clear signs that the recent annual publicity campaign for the TAVR has been most successful in terms of recruiting, and the smaller reserve and auxiliary forces of the other two Services are already well recruited. Although it does not appear that a Ministerial appeal for recruits is called for at this stage, the Prime Minister is pleased to associate himself with the noble Lord's sentiments.
§ Lord SHINWELLMy Lords, I am grateful for that Answer so far as it goes; but does not my noble friend realise, from his knowledge as a Minister in the Ministry of Defence, that our reserve position is far from satisfactory, although it is better than it was? Would he not, in the circumstances, emphasise to the Prime Minister the importance of the project, not only from a military standpoint but from an ethical, physical and social standpoint? If at any time I am to be rebuked for appearing to instruct the Prime Minister, may I say that my only qualification is that many years ago he was one of my junior Ministers.
§ Lord WINTERBOTTOMMy Lords, I thought that the Answer of my right honourable friend the Prime Minister was a positive one and was an indication of a former relationship. May I say that the present campaign for recruiting is going extremely well. There have been 13,754 requests for information since the campaign began in February. This compares with only 8,170 inquiries for the whole of last year.
§ Lord CLIFFORD of CHUDLEIGHMy Lords, would it not be for the national, social, employment and reserve advantage if our ex-Serviceman Prime Minister were to restore National Service and the reserve forces to the position there were in before the Chancellor's decimation? This might even discourage some of the unemployed ex-Servicemen from becoming mercenaries, since they could then have a country of their own worth fighting for.
§ Lord WINTERBOTTOMMy Lords, that is another question.
§ The EARL of KIMBERLEYMy Lords, does the Minister remember the speech made by His Royal Highness the Prince of Wales on 25th June last year, when he said that young boys were transformed when they joined bodies like the Coastguard and life-saving services? Would the Government consider mounting a recruiting campaign in schools which would enable the young of this country to get a spirit of adventure, so that when they leave school they might become Territorials?
§ Lord WINTERBOTTOMMy Lords, I am speaking from memory, but the noble Earl has possibly forgotten that the cadet corps and the Air Force cadets have no less than 130,000 members. That surely indicates that the interests of our own young men and women are being kept focused upon the need for national service in this area.
§ Lord ORR-EWINGMy Lords, would the Minister hear in mind that although the Prime Minister may have positive sentiments in accord with the Question, we want some positive publicity on these views? Would it not be more effective if the Prime Minister made a speech to the country, drawing attention to the fact that we have smaller reserves than any of 1259 our NATO allies, and that the Territorials presents a natural way in which young men can use their energies and dedication while at the same time helping to strengthen our national ability to defend ourselves and to contribute to the Alliance?
§ Lord WINTERBOTTOMMy Lords, since the Prime Minister has authorised the Answer I have given, I am sure he will pay attention to the points made here.
§ Lord SLATERMy Lords, is my noble friend aware that in the course of his reply he mentioned the young cadets but there was one very important section of cadets that he forgot to mention, and that is the Sea Cadets?—so the ships that sail upon the sea will eventually have manpower available, as these young people fit themselves for that type of service. Secondly, is my noble friend aware that it is not everyone who agrees with the recommendation about National Service? Once we start on that, we are asking for more trouble. Is it not true to state that the mass media at the moment are doing a very good job in setting out an order of campaign for the Services and the opportunities available for young men who are desirous of joining those particular Services?
§ Lord WINTERBOTTOMMy lords, I must apologise to the junior members of the Senior Service.
§ Baroness ELLESMy Lords, is there any Government policy directed towards helping those areas which have a great deal of school-leaver unemployment? Is this not exactly the kind of service which could encourage the young to do such service rather than stay at home on unemployment benefit, and would the Minister take note of this aspect?
§ Lord WINTERBOTTOMMy Lords, the noble Baroness must realise that we are talking of volunteers here: there are no conscripts. Therefore, if young people wish to join these forces they may do so, but we cannot compel them.
§ Baroness ELLESMy Lords, I understand that; but I was asking the Minister whether any encouragement or information was being given to the young to enable them to know what the opportunities are.
§ Lord WINTERBOTTOMMy Lords, I thought I had indicated earlier that there was.
§ Lord SHINWELLMy Lords, in view of the interest displayed in the House on this important topic, may I ask my noble friend whether he will emphasise to his right honourable friend the Prime Minister that he might occasionally spare five minutes in order to advocate the desirability of increasing our reserve forces?