§ [No. 14] In subsection (3), in line 7, leave out from ("containing") to ("and") in line 11 and insert ("such practical guidance as is referred to in that subsection")
§ Lord SHEPHERDMy Lords, I beg to move Amendment No. 14. The House will see Amendment No. 14A in the names of the noble Lord, Lord Goodman, the noble Earl, Lord Drogheda, and the noble Lord, Lord Gibson. If my understanding is correct, the effect of Amendment No. 14A is to limit the discretion of the Secretary of State if, in the event of the parties being unable to agree to a charter in 12 months, the duty of preparing the charter falls to him. The result would be that the Secretary of State would be able to include in the charter only matters which had been agreed by 1220 the parties if they did not fall within the matters listed in subsection (2).
My Lords, this is not a point on which the Government hold strong views. It is certainly our hope that this provision will not be used, and it is not our intention that the Secretary of State should provide in the charter for matters which are not included in the terms of reference. Rather he will act as an arbitrator or conciliator if, on any points, the industry cannot reach agreement, and if there is no agreement it might well be that only one or two points separate the parties. It is just possible that some of these points might technically not be within the scope of subsection (2) of the clause. However, in that case I would expect the Secretary of State to use his best endeavours to assist the parties to reach an agreement. Therefore at first sight the Amendment would not seem to stand in the way of an effective charter being made by the Secretary of State. Although 1221 therefore, the spirit of this Amendment is acceptable to the Government we shall need to take a careful look at the precise wording and make sure that the Amendment does what it is designed to do and no more.
If it is the wish of your Lordships' House to support Amendment No. 14A in the name of the noble Lord, Lord Goodman, it will be necessary for the House to decline the acceptance of Amendment No. 14, and then we can proceed to Amendment No. 14A. I have indicated the Government view on Amendment No. 14A merely to expedite progress.
§ Moved, That this House doth agree with the Commons in their Amendment No. 14 to Lords Amendment No. 10.—(Lord Shepherd.)
§ Lord GOODMANMy Lords, this is a substantial concession on the part of the Government on a matter about which we were deeply worried, and it augurs well for the future.
§ Lord SHEPHERDMy Lords, I am grateful for the reference that the noble Lord has made. This is a step towards bridging the two views, and it perhaps indicates that the Government have taken a flexible view in this important matter and are not guilty of the strictures that have been placed upon them on previous occasions by certain of the media and certain Members of your Lordships' House.
§ 6.24 p.m.