SOCIAL SECURITY (MARINERS' BENEFITS) REGULATIONS 1975 (Hansard, 24 March 1975)

§ Lord WELLS-PESTELL
My Lords, I beg to move that the Draft Social Security (Mariners' Benefits) Regulations 1975, laid before the House on 10th March, be approved. Your Lordships will know that arrangements to cater for the special employment conditions of mariners have always been recognised as a necessary part of our system of National Insurance, and that the Regulations which lay down the rules for mariners include the special arrangements for that unique group, the share fishermen. We intend to continue distinctive arrangements for mariners, and that is the purpose of the Regulations now before your Lordships' House.
For the general body of mariners, the primary change in April is the replacement of the Class 1 weekly stamp by wholly earnings-related contributions. The new Regulations governing mariners' contributions formed part of the Social Security (Contributions) Amendment (No. 2) Regulations 1974, which were approved by this House on 2nd December 1974. Share fishermen will pay a special rate of Class 2 contributions, and will continue to be eligible for unemployment benefit as well as for the normal range of benefits enjoyed by Class 2 contributors. The draft we are now considering relates, as its title indicates, to benefits. As I informed noble Lords when moving the approval of the contributions Regulations, there has been full consultation with the National Maritime Board and with share fishermen's organisations and the new contributions and benefits arrangements have the agreement of those bodies.
There are two main changes which affect the general body of mariners. On the one hand, cover will in future be restricted to mariners who are domiciled, or resident in Great Britain—this is achieved under the Contributions Regulations; while, on the other, it is extended to include as mariners those who are neither masters nor members of the crew; for example, hairdressers and people doing other jobs. The rules for share fishermen have also been extended to cover the man who no longer goes to sea but continues to receive a share of the boat's earnings in return for work, 1085 such as repairing nets, which is done ashore.
Regulation 1 is formal. Regulation 2 defines the terms used in the Regulations, and defines "mariner" so as to include all persons employed on board ship. One result of this extension is that it is no longer necessary to refer specifically to radio operators, as they will now come within the general definition. "Share fishermen" is also defined a little more closely than before and excludes men working under a contract of service, such as deep sea trawlermen, who come under the normal Class I arrangements. The definition is, however, extended to include the fisherman who has given up the sea but continues to do ancillary work ashore and to share in the boat's profits as a self-employed earner. Another minor addition to the overall scope of the mariners' provisions is that hovercraft, previously covered by the Hovercraft Interpretation Provisions Order, are now to be regarded as ships or vessels for National Insurance purposes.
Regulations 3, 4, 5 and 6 reproduce existing provisions, with some redrafting. Regulation 7 gives legal form to a concession which has operated administratively for a number of years and avoids a difficulty which would otherwise arise with claims to benefit based on contributions paid in respect of a foreign-going voyage. Contributions are payable at the end of a voyage, and when a mariner afterwards claims benefits based on those contributions they are normally in his record; but payment of the contributions is sometimes, for various reasons, delayed. Or a mariner may return to this country in advance of his ship and need to claim benefit. This Regulation provides for contributions due in respect of such a voyage to be treated as paid, until the actual contributions are recorded, and so enables the contribution conditions for benefit to be satisfied.
Regulation 8 is the core of the benefit rules for share fishermen since it enables share fishermen, who by definition do not work under a contract of service, to receive unemployment benefit. Paragraph 1 enables the specially high rate of self-employed earners' contributions, which share fishermen pay, to count for unemployment benefit. Paragraphs 2, 3 and 4 apply the fundamental unemploy- 1086 ment benefit rules, which of course normally apply only to employed earners, while paragraphs 5, 6 and 7 carry forward, without any significant changes, the special conditions which a seagoing fisherman must satisfy in order to qualify for unemployment benefit. Paragraphs 8 and 9 prescribe additional conditions for the new category of share fisherman who works ashore. Paragraph 10 of Regulation 8 repeats the existing provision to the effect that share fishermen have to satisfy not only the special requirements for unemployment benefit set out in these Regulations, but also all the normal conditions for benefit.
Regulation 9 extends the normal time limits of the National Insurance scheme where a mariner, including a share fisherman, cannot comply with them because he is, by reason of his employment, outside the United Kingdom.
My Lords, that, briefly, covers the Regulations. I beg to move.

§ Lord SANDYS
My Lords, the House will be grateful to the noble Lord, Lord WELLS-PESTELL, for describing these Regulations so accurately and in such detail. There are two questions that I wish to ask the noble Lord. The first comes under Regulation 1 and relates to the definition of "mariner" so far as the new situation which has arisen in the North Sea is concerned. Certainly it is not clear to me—and possibly it is not clear to my noble friends on this side of the House, or, for that matter, to those outside the House—whether a person who breaks his leg while working on an oil rig in the North Sea or on a semi-submersible or jack-up, and who becomes entitled to certain of these benefits is to be classed as a mariner or is to be put into another category.
In view of the fact that the noble Lord, Lord WELLS-PESTELL, referred to the new interpretation relating to hovercraft, it would be very helpful if the interpretation of "mariner" could be related to those persons who are connected with the new oil and gas industry in the North Sea. For that matter, new structures are being developed around our 1087 coasts which are not specifically connected with those two very important industries. In view of the new technology, it would therefore be helpful to know whether those who are working upon or are concerned with their maintenance and direction are included in the category of "mariner".
Secondly, turning to the question of share fishermen in Regulation 8, one general remark which I should like to make is that we bitterly regret the loss of the Boyd-Carpenter scheme which would have come into effect on 5th April. The question of the Class 2 contributions of share fishermen is in the forefront of our minds. In regard to their qualification for membership, out of some 6 million people in this country, the share fishermen represent a very small fraction. Nevertheless, they are a very important part of a large industry. Is it the case that share fishermen, who are at present part of a fishing cooperative, can benefit from the scheme which has been described by the noble Lord, Lord Wells-Pestell?

§ Lord WELLS-PESTELL
My Lords, I am very grateful to the noble Lord for telling me in advance that he wished to raise the question of people serving on oil rigs. If he had not done so, I should not have been able to answer him and I should have had to undertake to write to him. However, as he was generous enough to mention the matter to me, I can say that people working on oil rigs are not regarded as mariners and that they will not be included. The term and definition of "mariner" is not loosely defined. It is defined to mean those who are employed on a vessel, and their employment can be of any character. A moment or two ago I mentioned hairdressers. They must, however, be employed on a ship. Therefore, while those who are employed on ships serving the oil rigs will be covered by the Regulation, it does not extend to those who are working on oil rigs. Therefore, the same definition will apply to the other kinds of work mentioned by the noble Lord.
With regard to the second question that the noble Lord raised, concerning those who are working in a cooperative, although I am speaking off-the-cuff in relation to this matter I imagine that they would be in precisely the same position 1088 as those whom we refer to as "share fishermen". Therefore, what applies to share fishermen will apply also to those who are working in a cooperative, where it seems that the situation is much the same. If that is not the position, I will undertake to remedy the error and let the noble Lord know.
I do not wish to refer to the question of the contributions of the self-employed. We have been over this ground before. Perhaps I ought to mention that I said that the special rate relating to share fishermen will be £3.01 per week as against the normal £2.41 a week which the self-employed people who have an income of under £1,600 a year will normally pay. However, may I point out to the noble Lord that there will be an added advantage in the extra payment of 60p a week, in so far as those concerned will be eligible for unemployment benefit which is not normally extended to people who are self-employed.