§ Earl COWLEYMy Lords, I beg leave to ask the Question which stands in my name on the Order Paper.
§ The Question was as follows:
§ To ask Her Majesty's Government whether they will make a statement on Britain's aid programme to the newly independent State of Mozambique.
§ Baroness LLEWELYN-DAVIES of HASTOEMy Lords, Her Majesty's Government hope that discussions will be held as soon as possible with the Government of Mozambique which achieved independence yesterday. I am sure the whole House will join me in wishing the people of Mozambique a happy and prosperous future.
§ Earl COWLEYMy Lords, while thanking the noble Baroness for that Answer, and while wanting to join her in her good wishes to Mozambique for the future, may I ask her to say what amount of aid the Government are considering giving to Mozambique? Is the reported figure of £20 million correct? As it was the decision of the Commonwealth Heads of Government to assist "an independent Mozambique in applying sanctions" against Rhodesia, have any other Commonwealth countries made any aid contributions to Mozambique, or is Britain the only Commonwealth country which has made commitments in real terms?
§ Baroness LLEWELYN-DAVIES of HASTOEMy Lords, perhaps the impetuosity of youth has rather overtaken the noble Earl, because the Mozambique Government there have been the Govern- 1558 ment for only one day. Discussions entered into with Frelimo—whom we all thought would be the Government and are the Government—went a long way, but of course they cannot be binding on a fully independent Government. Therefore, I should not like to discuss any figures. Positive suggestions have been made, and I am quite sure that discussions are going on with other Commonwealth countries. But they, too, would find it quite impossible to commit the Government of Mozambique without having had full discussions, and I think that really sums up the position.
§ Lord LOVATMy Lords, when the noble Baroness wishes Mozambique a happy future, would she care to add "and a democratic one"?
§ Baroness LLEWELYN-DAVIES of HASTOECertainly, my Lords.
§ Earl COWLEYMy Lords, as the noble Baroness has not given any figures, may I ask her to give an assurance that any aid given to Mozambique will not necessarily mean drastic cuts being made in the existing aid programme from this country to other countries?
§ Baroness LLEWELYN-DAVIES of HASTOEYes, my Lords. As the noble Earl will know, any aid we give them comes within the general overall programme of aid, but I do not foresee drastic cuts as a result.
Lord HAWKEMy Lords, is the Minister aware that for every penny we give overseas we are now having to borrow from someone else overseas?
§ Baroness LLEWELYN-DAVIES of HASTOEThat may well be true, my Lords. But I must point out that, in any case, the first part of the aid for Mozambique will be programmed aid, and will pay for goods and services from this country.
§ Lord CARRINGTONMy Lords, I am sure that the noble Baroness will not accuse me of the impetuosity of youth. Nevertheless, will she say what she meant by the last answer to my noble friend? Are there or are there not going to be cuts?
§ Baroness LLEWELYN-DAVIES of HASTOEMy Lords, I would not accuse the noble Lord of the impetuosity of 1559 youth, but I occasionally find him impetuous. As he perfectly well knows, the programme of aid has been passed in another place. He knows what cuts were made and he can make his own deductions from that.
§ Lord CARRINGTONMy Lords, that was not my noble friend's supplementary question. He asked whether, if aid is given to Mozambique, it will mean some other people getting less.
§ Baroness LLEWELYN-DAVIES of HASTOEMy Lords, if one has a cake and makes certain cuts in it, it is then apportioned as one thinks best, and the judgment of this Government in their apportionment of aid is far better than any other Government I have ever had anything to do with.
§ Earl COWLEYMy Lords, may I ask the noble Baroness to say when she will be in a position to give the House the necessary figures?
§ Baroness LLEWELYN-DAVIES of HASTOEAfter the proper discussions have taken place with the Government of Mozambique, my Lords.