HL Deb 13 November 1974 vol 354 cc778-9

2.56 p.m.

LORD CHELWOOD

My Lords, I beg leave to ask the Question which stands in my name on the Order Paper.

The Question was as follows:

To ask Her Majesty's Government what progress has been made so far in the Conference on Mutual Force Reductions in Central Europe, and how long it is expected to continue.

THE PARLIAMENTARY UNDERSECRETARY OF STATE. FOREIGN AND COMMONWEALTH OFFICE (LORD GORONWY-ROBERTS)

My Lords, the negotiations on mutual force reductions are still at the exploratory stage and no agreement is yet in sight. But the subject matter is highly complex and all concerned recognise that it will take time to reconcile the differences of approach between the two sides. In the meantime the discussions are proceeding steadily in a businesslike fashion.

LORD CHELWOOD

My Lords, will the Minister give the House a firm assurance that Her Majesty's Government are not contemplating, and will not contemplate, any unilateral cuts in British Force strengths in the Central Front at NATO which are not agreed with our allies, and which are not in accordance with the assymetrical principle, which is one of the guiding principles of NATO?

LORD GORONWY-ROBERTS

My Lords, the noble Lord has succinctly and accurately summed up Her Majesty's Government's policy.

LORD SHINWELL

My Lords, does not my noble friend realise that all we are doing is to indulge in wishful thinking? In spite of this body of diplomats having met for quite a long time, they are still engaged in exploratory discussions. Does my noble friend really expect anything fruitful to emerge from these discussions? Can I have an assur-ance that the Government will not rely on fruitful prospects as a result of these discussions in their consideration of any reductions in defence expenditure?

LORD GORONWY-ROBERTS

My Lords, we are not engaged in these extremely difficult and important discussions in any spirit of incautious optimism. These are highly technical and complex discussions, and the question of security is uppermost in the discussions on both sides. I can give the assurances for which my noble friend has asked. As time goes on I think he will see that what he has suggested is born out in practice in the way in which we conduct these negotiations.

THE EARL OF KINNOULL

My Lords, would the noble Lord confirm that it would be Her Majesty's Government's firm policy that if any agreement is reached on any force cuts it would be subject to a system of verification?

LORD GORONWY-ROBERTS

My Lords, there can, of course, be no meaningful disarmament without full inspection and verification.