§ 2.42 p.m.
§ LORD BROCKWAYMy Lords, I beg leave to ask the Question which stands in my name on the Order Paper.
§ The Question was as follows:
§ To ask Her Majesty's Government whether they will stop the sale of arms to the Republic of South Africa.
BARONESS LLEWELYN-DAVIES or HASTOEMy Lords, Her Majesty's Government will continue the policy of an embargo on the export of arms to South Africa which we followed during our previous Administration.
§ LORD BROCKWAYMy Lords, while thanking the noble Baroness for that Answer, may I ask her the following question? I recognise that there must be some time for consideration, but will Her Majesty's Government, in looking at the Simonstown Agreement for the defence of the Cape route, bear in mind the request of nearly all the Asian nations that the Indian Ocean should be neutralised, so making that defence unnecessary?
§ BARONESS LLEWELYN-DAVIES OF HASTOEMy Lords, the whole question of arms supply to South Africa is under review, and I am sure that the House and my noble friend will understand if I do not wish to-day to go further into details. In any case, if I may say so, that question goes a little wide of the point.
§ LORD HARVEY OF PRESTBURYMy Lords, will the noble Baroness consider making a general statement at a future date on the sale of arms to overseas Powers generally? For example, there is some confusion about the sale of frigates to Greece, and thousands of workers' jobs on the Clyde could be endangered. I think that the House and the country would welcome a general statement of where the Government stand on this matter.
§ BARONESS LLEWELYN-DAVIES OF HASTOEMy Lords, that indeed goes very wide of this particular Question, but Her Majesty's Government will give satisfactory answers to all these questions.
§ LORD BARNBYMy Lords, I understand the Minister's wish not to be pressed to-day, but it was not plain from the original Question and Answer whether they referred to a sporting gun or to a submarine. Would it not be reasonable to assume, since in South Africa they can make anything but the most sophisticated equipment themselves, that if the embargo is confined to only a very limited range of arms we should have the dual disadvantage of losing employment here and weakening the effect of the defence of the Cape route, along which it is understood a million tons of oil pass a week?
§ BARONESS LLEWELYN-DAVIES OF HASTOE. My Lords, I can give a clear assurance that there is no aspect of the policy, whether economic or military or anything else, which will not be very clearly under review.
§ LORD CLIFFORD OF CHUDLEIGHMy Lords, is it not a fact that there is a proposal to reopen the Suez Canal? Does this not mean that the Russian Mediterranean Fleet will be able quickly to reinforce their Indian Ocean Fleet, so making Simonstown doubly important for our defence and the defence of the trade routes? Will Her Majesty's Government therefore do their best to delay the reopening of the Canal, and reinforce our friends' military potential at Simonstown?
§ BARONESS LLEWELYN-DAVIES OF HASTOEMy Lords, I think that the noble Lord's question, which he read, was about Suez and went very wide of the original Question.
§ LORD TREFGARNEMy Lords, if the Government prohibit the sale of arms to South Africa, and at the same time fail to secure the neutralisation of the Indian Ocean, how do they propose to secure the safety of the trade routes around the Cape?
§ BARONESS LLEWELYN-DAVIES OF HASTOEMy Lords, as I said earlier, this is all in the review. There is no aspect of our defence, or of our economic and Commonwealth policies, which is not in the review and I am perfectly confident of the result.