§ 2.42 p.m.
§ LORD SHINWELLMy Lords, I beg leave to ask the Question which stands in my name on the Order Paper.
§ The Question was as follows:
§ To ask Her Majesty's Government whether there has been any consultation with the French Government on the subject of their future association with NATO.
§ BARONESS TWEEDSMUIR OF BELHELVIEMy Lords, we keep close and regular contacts with the French Government on defence matters. France is crucial to Europe's effective future defence. But French views on their relationship with the integrated military organisation of NATO are well known.
§ LORD SHINWELLMy Lords, is it not time for pressure to be brought to bear on the French Government, not only by Her Majesty's Government but by the other NATO Governments, in order to bring the French back into the North Atlantic Treaty Organisation? Is the noble Baroness aware that the Minister of Defence—I regret his absence but no doubt there are substantial reasons for it—frequently talks about the need for a European defence organisation? How can there he an effective, efficient and adequate European defence organisation without having the French closely associated with NATO?
§ BARONESS TWEEDSMUIR OF BELHELVIEMy Lords, I think that the whole House knows of the personal concern of the noble Lord at the 595 effectiveness of NATO. I would agree with the assumptions behind his questions. I would also say, in passing, that my right honourable friend the Secretary of State for Defence has, of course, substantial reasons for not being present this afternoon. We enjoy very close consultation with the French on, for example, equipment projects and also in the work of the NATO Conference of National Armaments Directors. I would agree with what he has in mind, but I think it is a little too early for me to speculate here on French political developments.
§ LORD SHINWELLMy Lords, is the noble Baroness aware of the reason why the French remain out of NATO? Is it because of some treaty they have entered into with the Soviet Union?—there are suspicions about them, and rumours. If that is the position we ought to know. In that case we had better be much more wary of having the French in at all. Can we have some elucidation of the reasons why the French remain out?
§ BARONESS TWEEDSMUIR OF BELHELVIEMy Lords, it is a decision of long standing, going back to 1966. What is important is that the French will work with us, if not necessarily in a strictly defined integrated military organisation. We hope in the future to be able to work closely with them.
§ LORD GLADWYNMy Lords, is the noble Baroness aware that any direct pressure on the French Government regarding their rejoining NATO would be entirely counter-productive?
§ BARONESS TWEEDSMUIR OF BELHELVIEMy Lords, that is exactly why I did not say so.