§ LORD O'HAGANMy Lords, I beg leave to ask the Question which stands in my name on the Order Paper.
§ The Question was as follows:
§ To ask Her Majesty's Government whether they endorse Guidelines for a Social Action Programme, recently published by the Commission of the E.E.C.
THE EARL OF GOWRIEMy Lords, the Commission's guidelines were prepared as the basis for general discussion within the Community from which will emerge proposals for a programme of action to be agreed by the end of this year. As guidelines they do not require endorsement. Nevertheless, my right honourable friend the Secretary of State for Employment welcomed the general approach contained in the guidelines when they were discussed at the Council of Ministers on May 21. He also suggested a range of subjects which deserved particular consideration for inclusion in the agreed programme.
§ LORD O'HAGANMy Lords, since members of the European Parliament are not allowed to probe the details of this document in depth, will the Minister assure the House that he will be prepared to answer detailed questions about it, so that we may assist in the formulation of policy, before the end of the year?
THE EARL OF GOWRIEMy Lords, I am sure the whole House will be aware that the noble Lord's enviable reputation for harassing the Council of Ministers at the European Parliament has preceded him, and that the House will welcome the fact that he has now returned to harass me; but I am afraid I cannot give 526 detailed answers until they have themselves been discussed in Europe.
§ LORD SHEPHERDMy Lords, would the noble Earl appreciate that that answer is quite unsatisfactory as regards a national Parliament? Would he not agree that the European Parliament have no power whatsoever in fact, and it seems that there is no opportunity for penetrating questions to be put to the Council of Ministers? Will the noble Earl undertake to see that time is provided for this House to discuss this important Paper. when perhaps the noble Earl will be in a position to answer the debate?
THE EARL OF GOWRIEMy Lords, I will do anything the noble Lord would like me to in order to provide time for a discussion through the usual channels, but I think that is a somewhat wider point than the original Question.
§ LORD SHINWELLMy Lords, as those Members of your Lordships' House who were appointed to go to the European Parliament have experienced formidable difficulties, is it not now time they came to your Lordships' House and told us all about them, so that we may seek some kind of remedy on their behalf?
THE EARL OF GOWRIEMy Lords, I must repeat what I said to the noble Lord, Lord Shepherd: that many of my noble friends in the Parliament have been present in the last few days, and I am sure that the noble Lord, Lord O'Hagan, will be delighted to talk to the noble Lord at any time he would choose.
§ LORD HARVEY OF PRESTBURYMy Lords, would my noble friend not agree that the European Parliament would be considerably stronger if the Opposition Party played their role in it?
§ LORD SHEPHERDMy Lords, perhaps the noble Earl would explain to his noble friend how the European Parliament works and how ineffectual are all the Members of that Parliament. Would the noble Earl understand that Parliament looks to the national Government for advice and guidance on legislation which may come through as a consequence of these proposals?
THE EARL OF GOWRIEMy Lords, I am anxious to be helpful, but I would point out to the noble Lord that we are going to debate these subjects in detail on the 27th of this month.
§ LORD SHINWELLMy Lords, may I ask the noble Earl whether he is aware that in the other place it has now been reported by the appropriate Minister that Members of your Lordships' House and Members of another place are to receive further emoluments, together with secretarial and ancillary devices in order to maintain their positions? May we understand from that announcement that we are to have a similar announcement in your Lordships' House, so that we shall have an opportunity of expressing an opinion?
THE EARL OF GOWRIEI am sorry, my Lords, but I thought it would be self-evident that if changes were made, they would be announced in your Lordships' House.
§ LORD O'HAGANMy Lords, may I finally ask the noble Earl whether he is aware that almost all the Members of the European Parliament would welcome the arrival of the Labour Party from this country to help improve the composition and status of the European Parliament? May I also ask him whether, in the interim, he would give an undertaking that this House and the other place will be able to probe in detail Green Papers of the sort that we are now discussing?
THE EARL OF GOWRIEMy Lords, if it will help the noble Lord and other Members of your Lordships' House, I will certainly see whether these Guidelines can be made available in the Printed Paper Office.