§ 2.43 p.m.
§ LORD BARNBYMy Lords, I beg leave to ask the Question which stands in my name on the Order Paper.
§ The Question was as follows:
§ To ask Her Majesty's Government whether they can give any information on Press reports (June 23, 1973) of savage fighting in Burundi between the Hutu and Tutsi tribes; also what instructions have been given to our representative in the United Nations to secure a reduction of this alleged slaughter.
147§ THE MINISTER OF STATE, FOREIGN AND COMMONWEALTH OFFICE (BARONESS TWEEDSMUIR OF BELHELVIE)My Lords, it would not be right for me to comment on a matter of internal concern to a foreign country. No instructions have been given to our representative at the United Nations.
§ LORD BARNBYMy Lords, while appreciating the compassionate tone of the Minister's reply, and expressing my own horror at the barbarity of the previous massacres reported in Burundi, may I ask her whether, in view of the spate of Questions by the Opposition this Session on the internal affairs of foreign countries, she is aware that I expected a reply that Burundi is none of our business? But in view of the considerate reply, may I ask whether the noble Baroness has seen in to-day's Press the report that transport to Burundi is being denied by Tanzania, and if, in view of our having given support in another situation in Central Africa, it is now contemplated that there will be a subvention for that purpose to Burundi?
§ BARONESS TWEEDSMUIR OF BELHELVIENo, my Lords; it does not appear that the situation is comparable.
§ LORD HALEMy Lords, does the noble Baroness realise that this is a statement which is somewhat incompatible with Gladstone's Midlothian campaign; that in fact the estimates are that some 300,000 people have now been slaughtered in Burundi since the middle of last year—a literal decimation; that the blame rests quite clearly on President Micombero, who has a record of murder and assassination and public executions over the past six years, and the war broke out after the announcement on Bujumbura radio that the King, who had returned from his enforced exile under safe conduct from the President, had been murdered within a week of his arrival? Can the noble Baroness say whether the young King was in fact murdered after being flown in under safe custody by General Amin in his private plane? In view of the fact that Burundi is an associate member of the Common Market, and of the fact that it was a 148 United Nations trust territory (the noble Lord has properly mentioned the United Nations in this connection), surely this is a matter for discussion with the Commonwealth nations involved. It is said that there are 50,000 refugees in Tanzania alone, and we cannot stand wholly aside—
§ BARONESS TWEEDSMUIR OF BELHELVIEMy Lords, of course we all regret the numbers of those who were killed in the uprising last year. The figures vary very much and I would not put them as high as the figures the noble Lord quoted. Perhaps a conservative figure would be about 120,000; but that is bad enough. The noble Lord will recall that in reply to an appeal for help from the Burundi Government to the United Nations the Secretary General sent a three-man mission there in July. The mission's report stressed the responsibility of the U.N. to make sure that the international community, and donors of aid in particular, could ensure that assistance would reach the entire population and benefit the whole country, and as this was not possible the U.N. did not pursue the matter.
§ LORD BARNBYMy Lords, reverting to her first reply, when the noble Baroness said that the circumstances were not comparable, could she elaborate on the grounds on which, in the case of Zambia, when alternative routes were available, it was still thought necessary to charge the British taxpayer with an unnecessary large amount?
§ BARONESS TWEEDSMUIR OF BELHELVIEMy Lords, I think my noble friend knows very well that this particular Question does not refer to Zambia. I cannot, therefore, go into it in detail; I have indeed already replied to him on that point on another matter. But I would say that we have not been approached for aid by the Burundi Government, and, in view of what I have said about the U.N. report, it does not seem possible that any aid given would reach the population it is intended to reach.