SCHOOLCHILDREN'S SIGHT AND HEARING TESTS (Hansard, 16 March 1972)

§ BARONESS MASHAM OF ILTON
My Lords, I beg leave to ask the Question which stands in my name on the Order Paper.

§ THE PARLIAMENTARY UNDERSECRETARY OF STATE, DEPARTMENT OF EDUCATION AND SCIENCE (LORD BELSTEAD)
My Lords, local health authorities provide such services for children of under school age. Local education authorities may, by agreement with the proprietors, extend to pupils in non-maintained schools the medical services they provide for pupils in maintained schools.

§ BARONESS MASHAM OF ILTON
My Lords, while thanking the Minister for that Answer, may I ask him whether he does not think that children can suffer as much, if not more, in the way of educational troubles, from the physical defects that they may have; and does he not think that this service should be made available to all children?

§ LORD BELSTEAD
My Lords, if we are talking about the school health service, of course the obligation which local education authorities have under Section 48 of the Education Act 1944 is 510 to promote and maintain the health of the children in their own schools so that their education does not suffer. Implicit in the noble Baroness's Question, though, is: what about the other sector? My answer to that would be that the proprietors of non-maintained schools make their own arrangements for maintaining the good health of pupils attending their schools. Sometimes it is by their own arrangements for medical or nursing cover, and sometimes it is by arrangement with the local education authority itself.

§ LORD GARNSWORTHY
My Lords, I should like to ask the Minister whether he is satisfied that local education authorities have sufficient qualified staffs to undertake these and other essential medical inspections, including the examination of children who may be in need of medical milk.

§ LORD BELSTEAD
My Lords, on the question of sight, almost all pupils are tested during the first year of entry to school. Some authorities have annual tests thereafter, and all provide at least three tests during a pupil's school life. On the question of hearing, over three-quarters of all local education authorities test all children on entry into school; a few test them at age 6 or 7; and the remainder provide selective testing if there is any indication of a possible hearing problem. Without giving the noble Lord the statistics of staffing for which he has actually asked, and which I will try to send to him, that, I think, is the answer I ought to give him.

§ BARONESS LEE OF ASHERIDGE
My Lords, I think we are aware of the number of children who, because of poor sight and poor hearing, were supposed in the past to be backward and we know that a certain amount of care is now being taken in the schools. But will the Minister not listen very seriously to the plea which has been made, that all children should, automatically, have regular tests to ensure that their hearing and sight are normal?

§ LORD BELSTEAD
Yes, my Lords. I have given the statistics to the House. I should have thought they fell very well within the expression in the relevant section of the Act, "medical inspection at appropriate intervals". As regards the relevance of the noble Baroness's question 511 vis-à-vis the original Question, children who are not in maintained schools can, as I have said, be catered for, either by private arrangements made by the proprietors or by arrangements made between the proprietors and the local education authority. The House may like to know that it is a requirement of all independent schools which are recognised as efficient that, before recognition is given, suitable medical arrangements are made.

§ BARONESS SUMMERSKILL
My Lords, as the noble Lord has said that some non-maintained schools may have this service provided, can he tell me what conditions have to be fulfilled before the service is provided?

§ LORD BELSTEAD
My Lords, this is by arrangement between a proprietor and the local education authority.

§ BARONESS SUMMERSKILL
But why only "some" schools? The noble Lord said that "some" may have it provided. What does the proprietor have to prove to the local authority before he is given these services? Does he simply have to ask for them?

§ LORD BELSTEAD
Yes, my Lords.

§ LORD DAVIES OF LEEK
My Lords, is the noble Lord aware that the operative part of this Question is the phrase irrespective of the school that they may be attending"? Are education authorities encouraged to approach every school which is set up? Is the noble Lord aware that some private schools are set up and that, because of some snob value, people whose money is young send their children to schools which are almost Dame schools? Are schools like that first looked at from this point of view before they are allowed to teach children, of whatever class or whatever origin?

§ LORD BELSTEAD
No, my Lords. The relevant section for this is Section 78 of the 1944 Act, and under that section local education authorities are not so encouraged. This is the section under which an agreement has to be reached between the local education authority and independent schools, and it would be at the discretion of a local education authority—nothing more nor less. As regards the noble Lord's final remarks, 512 may I remind the House that it is open to any parents who are at all bothered about their children to seek the advice of their family practitioner and that the resources of the National Health Service are of course available to all children?

§ LORD GARNSWORTHY
My Lords, I am grateful to the Minister for the information given in reply to my supplementary question. May I ask him whether he will deal with what I think was the last part of that question: whether he is satisfied that the local education authorities have staffs adequate to examine all children who may be in need of medical milk?

§ LORD BELSTEAD
My Lords, I am sorry. It is extraordinary; but I did not pick up the expression "medical milk"—and we are talking about sight and hearing.

§ LORD LEATHERLAND
My Lords, may I ask the Minister about eyesight examinations carried out in a maintained school on, say, a child of 9? Is he aware that if that child is found to be in need of spectacles the parent has to pay a fairly heavy sum in order to get those spectacles supplied? Is that in accordance with the regulations?

§ LORD BELSTEAD
My Lords, I cannot answer the noble Lord's question—I must have notice of it—but I will do my best to write to him. I can tell him that guidance on special hearing and loss of vision tests to be performed by the local authorities is contained in memoranda of the Standing Medical Advisory Committee, as are the laid-down intervals at which hearing and loss of vision tests should be given.

§ LORD LEATHERLAND
My Lords, I should be grateful if the Minister would write to me.

§ LORD GARNSWORTHY
My Lords, is the Minister indicating that the staffs responsible for examination of school-children are not involved in inspecting children who may be in need of medical milk? I am certain that I used the term "medical milk" in my first supplementary. I should have thought that it was quite relevant. Are the staffs large enough to undertake these duties and all others they are called upon to perform?

§ LORD BELSTEAD
My Lords, I apologise for any discourtesy that I may have shown; it was not intended. The Government have no evidence that the staffs are inadequate.

§ BARONESS MASHAM OF ILTON
My Lords, would it be possible for the noble Lord to find out how many schools do not have health screening?

§ LORD BELSTEAD
My Lords, I could write to the noble Baroness. I cannot add to the answer which I gave to the first supplementary question of Lord Garnsworthy, in the course of which I gave the House some statistics on the screening of children for sight and hearing.

§ LORD SEGAL
My Lords—

THE LORD PRIVY SEAL (EARL JELLICOE)
My Lords, I hesitate to intervene; but it is past 3.15 and time that we passed to the second Question.