§ 2.52 p.m.
§ BARONESS SUMMERSKILLMy Lords, I beg leave to ask the Question which stands in my name on the Order Paper.
§ [The Question was as follows:
§ To ask Her Majesty's Government whether they will have warnings against venereal diseases printed on all packets of contraceptives having regard to the alarming rise in incidence of venereal disease.]
§ THE MINISTER OF STATE, DEPARTMENT OF HEALTH AND SOCIAL SECURITY (LORD ABERDARE)My Lords, we have given careful consideration to this interesting suggestion. We have decided on balance that it would not be right, as there is no evidence of any direct relationship between the use of contraceptives generally and venereal disease.
§ BARONESS SUMMERSKILLMy Lords, while I regret the fact that the Government are not prepared to accept this practical suggestion of mine, may I ask the noble Lord whether the Government have any alternative scheme calculated to warn young people—and it is mostly young people to-day who are becoming infected—of the danger of this disease?
§ LORD ABERDAREYes, my Lords. A good deal is going on. It is the responsibility of the Health Education Council nationally and local health authorities locally. There is a good deal of general propaganda and the Health Education Council are shortly to run an intensive six months' campaign in two London boroughs, Lambeth and Wandsworth, which we hope will give guidance in the most effective way of conducting these campaigns. Quite apart from that, we are improving staffing and facilities at hospital special clinics, improving methods of contact tracing and doing research.
§ BARONESS SUMMERSKILLMy Lords, does not the noble Lord realise that time is the very essence of this exercise? There were 150 fresh cases of 671 venereal disease in 1970 and this is a transmissible disease, so that each case could infect half a dozen others.
§ LORD ABERDAREMy Lords, we are pursuing this matter very actively. I suggest to the noble Baroness that perhaps the most effective way is through contact tracing.
§ LORD WYNNE-JONESMy Lords, would the noble Lord be prepared to see that steps are taken in the training of doctors, and also in the hospitals and the medical profession as a whole, to raise the whole status of those who are experts in these diseases? I think the noble Lord will find that at the present time the status of doctors specialising in these diseases is not ranked very high.
§ LORD ABERDAREMy Lords, I think there is a good deal in what the noble Lord says. The training of doctors comes under another Department, the Department of Education and Science; but I will certainly see that his remarks are taken into account.
§ BARONESS SUMMERSKILLMy Lords, may I correct a mistake that I made? I am told that I said there were 150 fresh cases in 1970. This, I am afraid, is wishful thinking. There were in fact 150,000 fresh cases in 1971.
§ LORD ABERDAREMy Lords, may I again correct the noble Baroness? There were in fact 53,617 cases.
§ BARONESS SEROTAMy Lords, would the noble Lord agree that on the side of treatment—and I very much welcome what he has just said about increasing the staffing at the much overloaded clinics—the problem that has to be faced is that, as compared with ten years ago, double the number of new cases are now coming along to clinics in our hospitals?
§ LORD ABERDAREYes, my Lords. That is the reason why we are increasing the staffing. We have already authorised 10 new senior registrar posts, 14 new registrar posts and 2 additional consultant posts.
LORD HAWKEMy Lords, would my noble friend not agree that television is the right place to put across a campaign of this sort?
§ LORD ABERDAREMy Lords, I am sure that the Health Education Council will consider that sugegstion.
§ BARONESS WOOTTON OF ABINGERMy Lords, is it not a fact that the only type of contraceptive which is normally sold in packets is itself a fairly good safeguard against venereal disease?
§ LORD ABERDAREMy Lords, that is certainly true, and it is one of the reasons why we did not feel able to accept the noble Baroness's suggestion.
§ BARONESS SUMMERSKILLMy Lords, may I ask the noble Lord whether both he and the noble Baroness have the information about contraceptives that I have? Is he aware that condoms are sold in packets? I agree with the noble Baroness that they are much safer. But, of course, pills are sold in packets, and pills are highly dangerous. An expert on the subject, Dr. Morton, the adviser to the World Health Organisation (I am sure the noble Lord has read what he said), has said that the pill has been more dangerous to the world than thalidomide.
§ LORD ABERDAREMy Lords, I think we are rather getting on to another subject. I have read Dr. Morton's book. The dangers of the pill are something quite different from venereal disease.
§ BARONESS SUMMERSKILLMy Lords, the noble Lord will forgive me, but we are thinking in terms of danger to health and danger to welfare. When thalidomide came to the world, men, women and children were shocked at the results. But the contraceptive pill is much more widespread and, in consequence of this, there is much greater danger of contracting venereal disease, because the contraceptive pill does not in the first place provide any protection, as the condom does, but nevertheless it also invites promiscuity.
§ LORD ABERDAREMy Lords, I think that even the noble Baroness will allow that the vast majority of people who use contraceptive devices are married or are in a perfectly stable relationship and in no danger of contracting venereal disease.
§ BARONESS SUMMERSKILLMy Lords, is the noble Lord aware that young women use contraceptive pills?
§ LORD ABERDAREYes, my Lords, very well aware: and also aware that many do not.
§ LORD THOMASMy Lords, has any thought been given to the form of words that would be used in this warning? Would it be a closely reasoned medical argument, or something precise and pragmatic like, "Buy me and stop one !"?