HL Deb 10 November 1971 vol 325 cc378-81

2.42 p.m.

LORD BROCKWAY

My Lords, I beg leave to ask the second Question which stands in my name on the Order Paper.

[The Question was as follows:

To ask Her Majesty's Government whether the Common Market Council of Ministers have endorsed the Statements of Mr. Rippon in another place and at a meeting with representatives of the Commonwealth Sugar Agreement at Lancaster House that their sugar exports would be maintained unimpaired after the Agreement was reviewed in 1974.]

THE MARQUESS OF LOTHIAN

My Lords, it has been agreed with the Community in the Negotiating Conference that the enlarged Community will have as their firm purpose the safeguarding of the interests of the developing countries whose economies depend to a considerable extent on the export of primary products and, in particular, of sugar. This solution was recorded as being accepted as satisfactory in the statement by the Governments represented in the June consultations in London. This statement has been placed on record with the Community.

LORD BROCKWAY

Yes, my Lords, but is it not the fact that Mr. Rippon made an interpretation of that formula which he afterwards reported to the Council of Ministers on June 17, and that when he reported it the Council failed to endorse his interpretation and instead only included it in its minutes? Further, did not a spokesman for the Council say afterwards that what Mr. Rippon had said at Lancaster House bound only Britain?

THE MARQUESS OF LOTHIAN

My Lords, I am not certain whether the noble Lord is quite correct on the last point. The assurance that the Six gave us is one which of course commits the enlarged Community as a whole. What happened was that the Community made their proposal to us—I think it was on May 13—and it was then for Her Majesty's Government to react. After these essential consultations in London with the developing countries concerned, who accepted the Community's proposal as satisfactory, we made our statement of acceptance to the Community, and the text of this statement was put on record with the Community. This really completed the negotiations on this issue, and no further discussion was expected or requested either by the Community or anyone else.

LORD GLADWYN

My Lords, would not the noble Marquess agree that, always supposing we are a full member of the European Economic Community in 1974, we shall be in a very strong position, to say the least, to see to it that the interests of the members of the Commonwealth Sugar Agreement are not materially prejudiced?

THE MARQUESS OF LOTHIAN

Yes, my Lords, I entirely agree.

LORD BLYTON

My Lords, is it not fair to say that inside the Community we shall have to observe the rules? Is there not going to be a development of the sugar beet industry in the Six which will be detrimental to the Commonwealth when the Commonwealth Sugar Agreement ends in 1974?

THE MARQUESS OF LOTHIAN

No, my Lords, I do not think so. I think the assurance the Community gave—and it was, after all, accepted by the sugar producing countries—is something that we can rely on.

LORD SHEPHERD

My Lords, is it not the fact that what the sugar producing countries accepted was the Government's interpretation, which has been recorded at Brussels but has not been accepted by the countries of the E.E.C.? Is it not a fact that, when the Sugar Agreement comes to an end, a new agreement will have to be negotiated, and that if no agreement is negotiated there will be no agreement in existence?

THE MARQUESS OF LOTHIAN

No, my Lords; I do not think that is right. I do not think one can place that interpretation on it. The developing countries have said that they are satisfied with the assurance given by the Community; the Community have heard that the developing countries are satisfied, and that is where the matter rests. I do not think that one can say that, because the Community have not expressed an opinion on that, therefore they do not agree. This is the situation as it is, and I think it is eminently satisfactory.

LORD SHEPHERD

My Lords, if the noble Marquess will please refresh his memory when he returns to his office I believe he will find that the Commonwealth sugar countries were deeply disturbed, and deeply concerned, with what Her Majesty's Government had originally negotiated with the E.E.C. countries. It was the new interpretation which they accepted, and which clearly at this present moment it appears that the E.E.C. countries have not accepted. As my noble friend has said, it is binding only on Her Majesty's Government.

THE MARQUESS OF LOTHIAN

My Lords. I will certainly undertake to refresh my memory, as the noble Lord has asked me to do. I still think that I am right. I think that the developing sugar countries have accepted the asurances given to Her Majesty's Government by the Community and that being the case I think the House should be satisfied that honour is satisfied in this matter.

LORD AVEBURY

My Lords, since the noble Marquess mentioned primary products generally in his initial answer, may I ask him whether, during the recent visit of Mrs. Bandaranaike, the Prime Minister of Ceylon, he discussed the question of tea imports into the United Kingdom and the Community in general, and whether the Prime Minister of Ceylon is satisfied with the arrangements that have been made?

THE MARQUESS OF LOTHIAN

My Lords, I cannot answer the noble Lord off-hand on that point; I would require notice of it. I think it is slightly off the point of the Question.

LORD BROCKWAY

My Lords, after all this exchange of opinion, is it not the fact that Mr. Rippon made one interpretation of the formula which was not endorsed by the Council of Ministers, and therefore the Council of Ministers have no responsibility for that interpretation, which is Britain's only?

THE MARQUESS OF LOTHIAN

My Lords, I do not think it is the fact. I should have thought that the assurance that was given to Her Majesty's Government—it may be that the noble Lord interprets it in a different way—and which was transmitted to the Governments of the developing sugar countries, and which they accepted, must be taken as a firm assurance.