§ LORD GARNSWORTHYMy Lords, I beg leave to ask the Question which stands in my name on the Order Paper.
§ [The Question was as follows:
§ To ask Her Majesty's Government what date they have set for the clearance of dereliction in the United Kingdom, and by what means they intend to achieve it.]
§ THE PARLIAMENTARY SECRETARY, MINISTRY OF HOUSING AND LOCAL GOVERNMENT (LORD KENNET)My Lords, the Government want local authorities to aim at a ten-year target for the clearance of derelict land, particularly in the development areas, intermediate areas and derelict land clearance areas. There are good indications that the high rates of grant now available are having the desired effect of stimulating action.
§ LORD GARNSWORTHYMy Lords, I thank my noble friend for that very encouraging reply. May I ask him what steps are being taken to give effect to the recommendations of the Committee which sat under the chairmanship of Sir Joseph Hunt and reported in April, 1969, particularly in regard to paragraphs 457 and 456 and with especial emphasis on paragraph 467? Can he inform the House whether it is the Government's intention to give effect to the recommendations of the Hunt Committee?
§ LORD KENNETMy Lords, I cannot quite remember what is in paragraph 457 of the Hunt Committee Report, but if, as I think is the case, it is about a national agency for the clearance of derelict land the answer is, "No". In the Government's 958 view it would be contrary to the spirit of the White Paper on local government reform to take the task away from local government in England. A new central group for derelict land clearance is being set: up, and Scotland and Wales have their own reclamation schemes.
§ LORD GARNSWORTHYMy Lords, I should like to point out—
§ LORD GARNSWORTHYMy Lords, may I ask my noble friend to take note that it was paragraph 467 and not paragraph 457 to which I was particularly referring? May I also ask what steps, if any, are being taken to require industry to dispose of future waste without creating a future dereliction?
§ LORD KENNETMy Lords, with the exception of tips which were already in use as such before about 30 years ago, this matter is under full planning control.
§ LORD GARNSWORTHYMy Lords, may I ask my noble friend whether it is the Government's intention so to control the disposal of new waste by industry that no new dereliction will be created in future?
§ LORD KENNETYes, my Lords, so far as that is humanly possible.
§ LORD BLYTONMy Lords, does my noble friend not think it is economics gone mad to charge rates on clearing pit heaps and then, if they are not cleared, to give 85 per cent. of Government grant to clear them?
§ LORD KENNETNot "mad", my Lords, no. The Finance Bill this year has provided that only about half of the royalty payments made by contractors to the owners of the tips shall count in future as income, the other half being capital; and the rating law is being revised to take account of that fact.
§ LORD LEATHERLANDMy Lords, may I ask my noble friend whether he does not think that there is a far more important task of clearing up to be done in the next few weeks?
VISCOUNT ST. DAVIDSMy Lords, does my noble friend not agree that the world must change and that therefore there will be continuous dereliction; and accordingly some continuous organisation 959 must be set up to deal with it as it occurs?
§ LORD KENNETYes, my Lords, that is very much in the minds of the Government. I would not accept the phrase "continuous dereliction". Dereliction is stuff that has been there for years and is not being used for anything, or added to.
§ LORD CONESFORDMy Lords, since when has derelict land been called "dereliction"? Is this usage known to any reputable dictionary?
§ LORD KENNETMy Lords, I cannot answer with authority, but within my experience, since the last 30 seconds or so.
VISCOUNT ST. DAVIDSMy Lords, is "derelict land" necessarily land? May it not be sea or other waters?