HL Deb 18 March 1970 vol 308 cc1130-2

2.37 p.m.

LORD SORENSEN

My Lords, I beg leave to ask the Question which stands in my name on the Order Paper.

[The Question was as follows:

To ask Her Majesty's Government what agency is now recognised in Rhodesia as competent to deal with the problems and needs of British citizens resident in that country; what is the official status of Rhodesians resident in or travelling to the United Kingdom; and whether the black African majority of those now living in Rhodesia are nominally recognised by the United Kingdom as British subjects.]

THE MINISTER OF STATE, FOREIGN AND COMMONWEALTH OFFICE (LORD SHEPHERD)

My Lords, the answer to the first part of this Question is, "None". As to the remainder of the Question, persons who possess Southern Rhodesian citizenship may also possess the citizenship of the United Kingdom and Colonies. Whether they do so or not, citizens of Southern Rhodesia, whatever colour they may be, like all other Commonwealth citizens are British subjects. This citizenship status is not affected by the fact that they may be resident in or travelling to the United Kingdom.

LORD SORENSEN

My Lords, while thanking my noble friend for that reply, may I ask him whether, if people going from this country to reside in Rhodesia for academic or business or similar purposes have been informed as to their status, it is assumed that so long as they remain there they are in some way conniving at the illegal Rhodesian régime? Further, as there has been a salutary withdrawal of so many consulates from Rhodesia, may I ask my noble friend to whom these people can now turn in the event of difficulties in that country?

LORD SHEPHERD

My Lords, I should have thought that anyone who resides in Rhodesia must know by now what is the state of affairs in that country; that is, that Rhodesia is in rebellion to the Crown. It therefore follows that United Kingdom citizens who live in, or stay in, or visit Rhodesia must, as the Prime Minister said recently in another place, do so at their own risk. As regards the overseas consulates that have been closed, clearly these could not render any assistance to United Kingdom citizens residing in or visiting Rhodesia, and our own residual mission that was withdrawn after the referendum was not there to help British citizens.

LORD SORENSEN

My Lords, may I ask a further question? By what means do British citizens now living in Rhodesia communicate with this country? Is it possible to communicate by post, by cable or by telephone?

LORD SHEPHERD

My Lords, until recently, of course, they could correspond through the post, through the telephone and Through the telegraph. But now, as a consequence of Republican status being taken in Rhodesia, the question of the stamp which the régime has produced has had to be taken into account; and as my noble friend will know, such a stamp will not be regarded as a legal postage stamp for delivery in this country.

LORD SORENSEN

My Lords, then how can they send letters?

LORD SHEPHERD

My Lords, that is one of their difficulties. Clearly, if they were to write a letter addressed to this country it would be delivered, but there would be a collection of postage when the letter was delivered.

VISCOUNT ST. DAVIDS

My Lords, can my noble friend tell me whether there is any British businessman in Rhodesia who ought to be having business in Rhodesia?

LORD SHEPHERD

My Lords, we have said that it would be wrong for a British citizen, or, for that matter, anyone else, to trade with the illegal régime in Rhodesia.

THE LORD BISHOP OF LEICESTER

My Lords, have Her Majesty's Government considered the position of missionaries?

LORD SHEPHERD

My Lords, clearly we have had to consider all aspects, but the fact is that if we were to have a mission in Rhodesia of the normal consulate type it would be construed by those who wished so to construe it as recognition of an illegal régime.

THE LORD BISHOP OF LEICESTER

My Lords, that was not exactly the point I was making. My point was whether Christian missionaries come under the rather sweeping condemnation that I thought the Minister had expressed.

LORD SHEPHERD

I beg the right reverend Prelate's pardon. Clearly, I think Christian missionaries, certainly from my experience, are in quite a different class from businessmen.

LORD GRIMSTON OF WESTBURY

My Lords, could the noble Lord offer any opinion as to how long the Government expect this state of affairs to continue?

LORD SHEPHERD

My Lords, it will come to an end a good deal sooner if those who have in one way or another given support to the illegal regime cease to do so.

LORD CARRINGTON

My Lords, may I ask the noble Lord a rather simple question about a rather small point? Suppose I get a letter from Rhodesia which I have not asked for. Do I have to pay the surcharge, or can I send it away again?

LORD SHEPHERD

My Lords, I think it is up to anyone in this country to do what he wishes with a letter. He is not forced to accept it.

LORD GRIMSTON OF WESTBURY

My Lords, is the noble Lord aware that there is a good deal of opinion in this country that it is Her Majesty's Government who by their policy have driven Rhodesia into the present position?

LORD SHEPHERD

My Lords, only those who do not face up to the facts and read recent history.