§ LORD SUDELEYMy Lords, I beg leave to ask the Question which stands in my name on the Order Paper.
§ [The Question was as follows:
§ To ask Her Majesty's Government whether they have power to give a direction to British Railways not to remove any more of the wrought-iron gates leading to the canopy of Marylebone Station, and, if so, whether they will exercise that power.]
§ THE PARLIAMENTARY UNDERSECRETARY OF STATE, DEPARTMENT OF THE ENVIRONMENT (LORD SANDFORD)No, my Lords; not such as would be applicable in this case.
§ LORD SUDELEYMy Lords, while thanking the Minister for his reply, may I ask whether he does not think that it would be a great pity that these charming gates should go, since whoever put forward the arrangements for their removal 1368 does not expect us to agree with him and the gates are going in order to satisfy a tidy mind?
§ LORD SANDFORDNo my Lords, I would not agree that these gates come up to the special category of historic or architectural interest which would justify their being left and protected in this way. Nor would I agree that their retention is a matter of such great national interest that my right honourable friend the Secretary of State would be entitled to interfere in the general day-to-day management of British Rail. I understand that one pair of gates has been removed in the interests of road safety. The other pair, which is still in position, has been offered to the Victorian Society, who have been invited to negotiate for them.
§ BARONESS PLUMMERMy Lords, the noble Lord has partly answered the question I wished to ask, because I wanted to know what was going to happen to these gates. May I ask him whether it would be not so much a matter of exercising power as of seeing if a few kind words could do something about it?
§ LORD SANDFORDMy Lords, in respect of one pair of gates it is a matter of past history. In respect of the other, I think that a very desirable outcome has been arrived at without the necessity of the Secretary of State's intervention.
§ LORD BURNTWOODMy Lords, does the noble Lord feel satisfied that there are people in British Rail who are adequately sensitive to the demands of the public that we should retain items of general and industrial historic interest?
§ LORD SANDFORDMy Lords, I do not believe that that is for me to say. In respect of those parts of British Rail which do match up to the historic or architectural interest that would merit their listing, the opinion of my right honourable friend the Secretary of State would be relevant, but in this particular case it is not relevant.
§ LORD LINDGRENMy Lords, would not the noble Lord agree that, while these gates are ornamental, their cost of maintenance is quite heavy, and that this cost is not in proportion to their utility value?
§ LORD SANDFORDMy Lords, I would agree.