HL Deb 03 December 1969 vol 306 cc99-102

2.36 p.m.

LORD GISBOROUGH

My Lords, I beg leave to ask the Question which stands in my name on the Order Paper.

[The Question was as follows:

To ask Her Majesty's Government whether they will recommend to the Post Office that they should indicate in future telephone directories the exchange names in addition to the exchange numbers wherever possible.]

LORD BOWLES

My Lords, compilation of telephone directories is a matter of management for the Post Office, which became a public Corporation on October 1 of this year.

LORD GISBOROUGH

My Lords, while I thank the noble Lord for his Answer I do not in fact think it is really fair because, after all, the Question does ask whether the Government would be prepared to make this recommendation to the Post Office. Is the noble Lord not aware that the insertion of the exchange name would be of great help in dialling a number? Having found a number in the directory, it is extremely difficult to remember it, with its seven figures instead of a name; indeed, it is quite impossible to remember all the seven figures with which one has to deal. Would not the noble Lord agree that it would be possible to put the exchange name, let us say "KNI", for "Knightsbridge", before the numbers, and the numbers in brackets, so that the advantage of the old system may be retained without interfering with the new one?

LORD BOWLES

My Lords, this House passed an Act, called the Post Office Act 1969, in which it gave power to the Postmaster General to direct and give advice to the Post Office on matters mentioned in Section 11, subsections (1), (2), (3) and (4), and the House must regard itself as bound by that Act. If the noble Lord looks at The Times of yesterday he will see the picture of "Ann", under which appear the words "All-figure numbers now". It is most important to realise that we are increasing the number of telephone exchanges. Therefore, if the noble Lord thinks for a moment, he will see that while Whitehall is 930, which is clear, if the next exchange was 931 "WHJ" would not be a word at all. It is also most important for international dialling, because some foreign countries have no letters at all, and some have an alphabet different from our own.

The third reason for this method—and this has all been publicised by the Post Office in the advertisement—is that when people outside London dial a number in London they now start off by dialling "01" and then seven letters, which I do not find it all that difficult to forget. But soon it will be necessary to decentralise, and instead of all these calls going into the centre of London they will go to different parts of London. This will therefore entail two different first numbers in the first three.

LORD BYERS

My Lords, while accepting that as a fascinating narrative, is the answer "Yes" or "No"?

LORD BOWLES

The answer is, No.

LORD GISBOROUGH

My Lords, would not the noble Lord agree that while it may not be possible to allow everybody to have these letters, it is advantageous for those for whom it is possible, albeit hard luck on those who cannot have them?

LORD BOWLES

My Lords, they will all be out of date by the beginning of next year.

LORD FRASER OF LONSDALE

My Lords, whilst thanking the noble Lord for his almost unintelligible Answer, may I ask him whether he is not of the opinion that if my noble friend's request were met the telephone book would be another couple of inches wider or possibly twice as big?

LORD BOWLES

Yes, my Lords, I quite agree.

LORD IRONSIDE

My Lords, would not the noble Lord agree that it would be possible to put a list of the numbers and their equivalent letters at the beginning of each directory in use in London?

LORD BOWLES

No, my Lords; we are not giving any directions on this matter to the Post Office?

EARL FERRERS

My Lords, in view of the noble Lord's rather abrupt Answer to my noble friend's original Question, is one to infer that Members of your Lordships' House may not in future ask Questions about the Post Office or refer to it, because it is not now directly under the Government?

LORD BOWLES

Yes, my Lords; that was one of the reasons for passing the Act.

EARL FERRERS

My Lords, we may not ask Questions of the Government about the Post Office?

LORD BOWLES

My Lords, under subsections (1), (2), (3) and (4) of Section 11 of the Post Office Act.

LORD INGLEWOOD

My Lords, can the noble Lord say whether we are going to get any better answers from Lord Snow?

LORD MOYNE

My Lords, is the noble Lord confirming the regrettable statement, which I understood from a telephone operator, namely, that one will not be allowed to ask for exchange names as well as numbers in future: that the exchange names are to disappear from use next year? That is what I understood from the telephone operator and what I rather read into part of the noble Lord's reply, which, however, was rather complicated.

LORD BOWLES

My Lords, when I have read the noble Lord's question I will write him a letter.