§ 3.12 p.m.
§ LORD OAKSHOTTMy Lords, I beg leave to ask the Question which stands in my name on the Order Paper.
§ [The Question was as follows:
§ To ask Her Majesty's Government when and in what circumstances the recent outbreak of foot-and-mouth disease near Oswestry was discovered; whether the outbreak was known at the time that animals were still in the market, and, if so, whether any animals were later allowed to leave.]
§ LORD BESWICKMy Lords, a suspect case of foot-and-mouth disease in pigs on a farm near Oswestry was reported to the veterinary service on October 25 at 2.40 p.m. A veterinary officer arrived at the farm at 3.30 p.m., a standstill order (Form C) was imposed at 4 p.m., and the disease was confirmed at 5 p.m. The total head of stock entered at Oswestry market was about 7,000, of which some 5,000 had already been moved by 4 p.m., when the standstill order was imposed. Two cattle had gone from the farm on which the disease was discovered to Oswestry market. They had not been in close contact with the diseased pigs, and were returned to the farm where, on examination, they were found to be healthy. Therefore it was decided on veterinary grounds that the fatstock left standing in Oswestry market could be licensed safely to slaughterhouses within the infected area, and other stock to other premises within the infected area.
It is normally the practice of the veterinary service to slaughter affected animals and dangerous contacts. What is a dangerous contact is a matter for veterinary decision based on a knowledge of the disease and the circumstances of each individual case. The contacts in Oswestry market were indirect contacts, and in the opinion of the Minister's veterinary advisers the danger in the dispersal of this stock to premises within the infected area was very small indeed. Time has now shown that, having regard to the incubation period of the disease, the animals in Oswestry market could not have picked up infection there, though two became affected later from other sources and more may, of course, 489 follow if the epidemic continues. I should like to add that I am sure the whole House will join with me in expressing sympathy to the farming community who have been affected in this very grievous way.
§ LORD OAKSHOTTMy Lords, I thank the noble Lord for that very full reply. If your Lordships will allow me, I should like to thank him, too, as one who comes from Cheshire—and in Cheshire, Shropshire, and the neighbouring North Wales counties there is a heavy shadow of apprehension hanging over the farming community at the present time—for the sympathy that he has expressed. May I ask the noble Lord whether it is not perhaps too much of a coincidence that there should have been this heavy concentration of outbreaks in the immediate neighbourhood of Oswestry which then spread into the adjoining areas and counties? In view of the, unhappily, very small amount of knowledge that we have of this disease, is it not wrong to take any risks at all? Might it not have been better to have retained the 2,000 animals who were in the market when the outbreak was known rather than to allow them to disperse. Although the two cows from a farm near Oswestry are still apparently unaffected by the disease, it is well established that just the same they could have been carriers of it.
§ LORD BESWICKMy Lords, the best advice available suggests that the spread could not have originated from the Oswestry market animals. Had the disease been carried by them, it would have spread to other parts of the country; because some of the sales from Oswestry were to places such as Devon and Scotland; and, of course, as yet there has been no outbreak in those areas. As for the suggestion which the noble Lord makes, in perfectly good faith, no doubt, that the animals should have been retained in the market, as I said, a standstill order was imposed at 4 p.m. as soon as this particular origin was discovered. After that period no animal left, unless to a slaughterhouse or to another agreed premise within the infected area.
§ LORD OAKSHOTTMy Lords, I am sorry to press the noble Lord on this point. I appreciate what he has said. But is it not the case that the movement of these animals was allowed, not necessarily 490 to slaughterhouses, but to other approved premises within a certain radius? Was there really any reasonable chance of policing their movement within that radius? Could they not have gone far beyond if the owner had felt like it?
§ LORD BESWICKMy Lords, as I have tried to explain, the movement from the market of these 2,000 animals, most of whom did not leave until the following day, was under control and to premises completely under control, all of which premises were within the ten-mile radius. As for the area over which the disease spread like wildfire, one theory is that the virus was windborne; and credence is lent to this theory because of the direct spread in a funnel shape to the North and not to the other areas to which I have referred to which some of the animals from Oswestry had gone before 4 p.m.
THE EARL OF MANSFIELDMy Lords, arising out of the various replies the noble Lord has given, I wonder whether Her Majesty's Government realise that this outbreak is not only unprecedented in severity but unprecedented in the speed of its spread. Will the Government therefore consider instituting a more than usually searching inquiry into the causes and origin of this outbreak?—because it is one that has caused the very greatest disquiet to agriculture all over the country.
§ LORD BESWICKMy Lords, as a matter of fact, for what it is worth the outbreak is not greater than have been some outbreaks in the past. It is, at this moment at any rate, only half that which occurred in 1961—but we get no satisfaction from that. The noble Earl is right about the speed with which the contagion has spread, and I am sure he is quite right, also, when he said that the most searching inquiry will have to be made.
§ LORD ROYLEMy Lords, on a more general question, I wonder whether my noble friend can say what research is taking place with regard to the cure of the disease? Surely, in these advanced scientific days, one would expect there to be other methods of dealing with this than mass slaughter.
§ LORD BESWICKMy Lords, I quite understand the question of my noble 491 friend. This is one of the points that I have myself inquired about. I am told that there is an enormous amount of research now going on at Pirbright at the National Virus Research Institute. I should have thought that it would be very difficult to place any limit on the research which ought to be carried out into this disease.
THE EARL OF MANSFIELDMy Lords, will the noble Lord's Department take special care to investigate the possible spread of the disease through the agency of birds such as the starling and the gull? This has been suggested on many occasions, but there does not yet seem to have been any really adequate investigation.
§ LORD BESWICKI will look into this matter again, my Lords, but I am assured that this possibility is being investigated—not only the spread by animals, but by birds and, as I said, by the wind.
§ LORD OAKSHOTTMy Lords, may I ask one final question of the noble Lord? I am sure that the risks were minimised so far as they could be—I fully accept that. But in view of the comparatively small amount of knowledge that we have about this disease, and therefore of the necessity for not taking any avoidable risk at all in an outbreak of this kind, would the noble Lord not agree that the time may have come for an immediate review of the regulations which would guide the decisions of the Ministry's inspectors and veterinary officers should a similar set of circumstances like this arise in a market?
§ LORD BESWICKMy Lords, I am sure that the Department is only too anxious to learn what it can from an outbreak of this kind, and I will certainly see that the point the noble Lord has made is considered. But there is absolutely no reason to believe that anything was done which ought not to have been done. While I have, on behalf of the House (and I am sure everyone agrees with it), offered our sympathy to the farming community, I should also like to take the opportunity to say a word on behalf of the veterinary officers of the Ministry who have been working literally night and day since this outbreak occurred.
LORD SALTOUNMy Lords, have Her Majesty's Government been able to 492 form a tentative estimate of the liability for compensation so far in this outbreak?
§ LORD BESWICKNo, my Lords. Compensation will be paid in the normal way, but the total amount involved will of course depend on the numbers involved, and we are not at the end of the outbreak as yet.