SALMON FISHING OFF GREENLAND (Hansard, 5 April 1967)

§ LORD RATHCAVAN

My Lords, I should like to say a few words in support of my noble friend Lord Balfour of Inchrye, who has always taken such a great interest in this question of salmon fishing. I would ask the noble Lord, Lord Hughes, whether he can say what was the result of a meeting which, I think, took place in Canada two years ago to discuss this whole question, where there were representatives of people connected with salmon fishing both from this 1064 side of the Atlantic and from the other. For all time it has been a mystery where the salmon went when they left the fresh waters of the rivers to go into the sea, to remain there for one or two years before they came back to spawn. Can the noble Lord say whether the scientists have established that this part of the sea near Greenland is really the place where the bulk of the salmon go from Europe and from North America, or is it only a place where some of them go? But whether it is the one or the other, there can be no doubt whatever that my noble friend is right when he says that this is an extraordinarily serious menace to the salmon fisheries.

There is one other question which I should like to ask the noble Lord. I think there have been a certain number of fish caught off Greenland which have been tagged in some of the rivers in this country, and probably in Canada as well. Can he say whether that is the case and, if so, does it show that of the fish caught off Greenland by the fishermen there a great number have come from the rivers in Europe and from the British islands?

§ LORD HUGHES

My Lords, I think it is almost two years since the noble Lord, Lord Balfour of Inchrye, first raised this subject and we debated this matter. He performed a service then in directing your Lordships' attention to the fishery for Atlantic salmon which has developed off the coast of Greenland. He does so again, and I am glad to have this opportunity to report to your Lordships on the action which has been taken since we debated the matter in 1965 and on the further steps which are in prospect. What I have to say will, I think, answer both of the points raised by the noble Lord, Lord Rathcavan.

First, may I very briefly recapitulate? It is now five or six years since it became apparent that the fishery off Greenland was expanding very rapidly. It did so from a catch that was negligible in 1957 to a peak of some 1,400 metric tons in 1964, or more than the total Scottish salmon catch in the same year. This caused great concern in Britain, because although we had very little definite information about the sea life of salmon bred in British waters there was a belief that their feeding grounds were somewhere off Greenland; and this belief 1065 was strengthened in 1964 when we had evidence of the recapture in Greenland waters of five salmon tagged in Scotland. But the position remained obscure. We did not know the answers to two vital questions: what proportion of the salmon leaving Britain did, in fact, go to Greenland for part of their sea life; and what proportion of those which did so would normally return to our own waters and be available to our industry. Yet this was precisely the kind of information we needed before we could make any assessment of the likely effect of the new Greenland fishery on our own salmon stocks.

This was the position when we debated the matter in July, 1965, when I stressed to your Lordships that to secure regulatory measures international agreement was necessary, and that to secure this agreement we needed scientific evidence about the state of the stocks and the need to protect them. Since then we have been trying by all means open to us to obtain scientific information, and in this quest I am happy to say that we have received the fullest and most cordial co-operation from the Danes themselves. In 1965 we sent a team of scientists from Scotland to work with Danish scientists at Greenland. Their main object was to catch and tag salmon there in the hope of finding out whether the salmon found off Greenland return to their native waters and, if so, to which rivers. A total of 223 salmon were tagged in 1965.

This work was intensified in 1966, when scientists from Scotland, England and Denmark spent several weeks at Greenland engaged on tagging and other investigations, including taking samples of the catches for size and age and also studying the blood groups and parasites of the fish to try to find a direct means of determining from which areas the individual salmon had come. A total of 728 salmon were tagged in the course of this work. Again, the scientists had full co-operation from the Danish authorities, who provided interpreters and two fully-manned research vessels. In addition to this work in Greenland waters we took steps to secure a marked increase in the number of smolts tagged as they left this country. Last year, therefore, saw an upsurge in activity as it were, at both ends of the problem: many more smolts were tagged in the United Kingdom 1066 to provide information about their destinations in the sea; and many more adult salmon were tagged at Greenland so that we might see what proportion of the fish found there returned to our waters.

What results have we achieved from this work? Of all the smolts and kelts tagged in Scotland between 1961 and 1965, a total of some 68,000, the number recaptured in Scottish waters has been 1,732. In addition 32 have been taken off Greenland. More particularly, of the 12,500 tagged in Scotland in 1965, eleven were recaptured off Greenland last year. The corresponding figures for smolts tagged in England and Wales were six recaptured at Greenland out of 6,000 tagged, while we know also that 102 tagged Canadian smolts were recaptured out of 62,500 liberated.

Although these figures make it certain that at least some of our salmon do go to Greenland, it would clearly be unwise to draw any general conclusions from them. The situation is similar when one considers what happens to salmon tagged at Greenland. Of the 223 tagged there by the scientists in 1965 only one has been recaptured—at Newfoundland. Similarly, of the much larger number tagged last year, only one has so far been recovered, this time in the River Tweed. This is an important development, for hitherto there has been no evidence that fish have come from Greenland to Scottish rivers. We now know that this does happen and, in consequence, the value of the scientific investigations is plain: but clearly it would be wrong to base major conclusions on the evidence of a single fish.

As yet, therefore, we cannot say definitely what proportion of the fish which are being captured at Greenland are fish which would not in any event have returned to our shores but would have figured among the 90 per cent. or so which leave us as smolts and never return. For if it transpires that most of the fish taken at Greenland must be counted in this 90 per cent. loss, then the development of the Greenland fishery will not be at the expense of our stocks. It will take some time to obtain the answer to this question. For it we must await further results from the increased tagging done last year and from future work.

I have given these details to show some of the difficulties in carrying out our investigations and in establishing on a 1067 scientific basis the need for international conservation measures. This is not to say that no discussions have taken place. As I informed your Lordships in 1965, when we approached the Danish authorities about limiting the Greenland fishery while investigations were being carried out, they did not feel able to accede to this request, since they considered that there was only a slight probability that the fishery, even though substantially increased, would have any appreciable impact on European or American stocks of salmon. We have therefore had, of necessity, to concentrate our efforts on scientific work, in which, as I have said, the Danes have willingly co-operated.

In this connection—and this is the other point to which the noble Lord, Lord Rathcavan, referred—a joint working party has been set up by two of the main international bodies concerned, the International Commission for the Northwest Atlantic Fisheries, and the International Council for the Exploration of the Sea. This working party met in Madrid in May of last year and again in Copenhagen in October. They have since completed a report, but because they do not have some of the crucial information needed they have not been able to come to definite conclusions on the main issues. They have, however, made recommendations for the intensification of research, and have defined in more detail the investigations which could help to throw more light on the problem.

In passing, may I say that in due course we expect to receive a number of copies of this report, and if the noble Lord, Lord Balfour of Inchrye, and the noble Lord, Lord Rathcavan, would like the opportunity of having a look at it I shall be glad to arrange for it to be made available to them. Whether I can give it to them to keep, or whether they will merely get it to read, I do not know, because I am not aware how many copies will be available. But at least I think I can offer them the chance of looking at it.

It is of course disappointing that the Danish authorities have not seen their way to introduce a positive limitation on the fishery, but in view of what the noble Lord, Lord Balfour of Inchrye, has said about the position of the Greenlanders, while we may regret their action, or their lack of action, we can understand it. As 1068 he said, although the position improved in 1965 in that it fell from 1,400 tons to 857 tons, it is a matter which must be of concern to noble Lords that in 1966 the position worsened; and as we understand it the catch in 1966 was 1,292 tons—not so very far short of the peak in 1964.

I might add—and I think the noble Lord, Lord Balfour of Inchrye, referred to this—that the lower figure of 1965 did not mean that the salmon were less abundant off the Greenland coast that year. It was simply that it was paying them better to fish for what they prefer to fish for, which is cod. It was the poor cod fishing in 1964 which sent them on the track of salmon in the numbers in which they went. I may say that when I was in Denmark last year I was appalled to be told that the Greenlanders did not regard salmon fishing as a normal exploit at all. They may of course be changing their minds as a result of experience in recent years, but originally if they caught a salmon the only useful purpose to which they conceived it could be put was for it to be cut up and used as bait to catch cod. Obviously, they were not doing that with 1,292 tons last year.

My Lords, I have given a full account of the work which has been done and which is on hand. I cannot claim that negotiations with the Danish Government are in train, or that there is any prospect of securing either an international agreement for a general limitation on the fishery for Atlantic salmon or a specific and direct agreement relative to Greenland's territorial waters. Because of the great significance of the fishery for Greenland's economy, and the many unknowns and imponderables, we must be on firmer ground in regard to scientific evidence than we yet are if we are to have any prospect of establishing the need for limitation. The picture I present, therefore, is one of increased scientific investigation, evaluation and discussion, aimed at producing this scientific basis. That our efforts have not been successful will not surprise any of your Lordships who know the enormous difficulties and problems involved in this region, where there are such gaps in our basic knowledge. But I assure your Lordships that we will develop and intensify this work still further, fully conscious of the important issues involved, and of the need 1069 to avert any possible threat to this important natural resource of ours.

The noble Lord, Lord Balfour of Inchrye, referred to drift netting outside of territorial waters. This is a matter which is occasioning concern to the Canadian Government. The noble Lord has probably seen—and I cannot refer to this at any length—that the Canadians are to attempt to get a prohibition on salmon fishing on the high seas in the area for which the North-West Atlantic Council are responsible. Having said that, he would not expect me to commit Her Majesty's Government to any course of action, because it would be quite wrong if we created the impression that we went to a council meeting of this kind to hear the evidence as put forward, and at the same time demonstrated that we had made up our minds in advance what we were going to do about it. But we shall be very interested in what evidence the Canadian have to offer, because it may well be that the menace of deep-sea extraterritorial fishing for salmon will prove in due course an even greater menace than the fishing in inshore waters.

Having said that, I should like to assure the noble Lord, Lord Balfour of Inchrye, that I am very interested in the new approach which he has suggested. I shall certainly be happy to discuss this with my colleague at the Scottish Office who now has responsibility for these matters, and with his officials. I will certainly see that this suggestion is conveyed to them. It is not completely new, because we tried a limitation before, but without success. However, this is a variation of it. It is not asking somebody else to do 1070 something for our benefit: it is a proposal which implies that we also are prepared to share in the sacrifice. My first reaction is that it is a proposal which is well worthy of consideration, and I certainly will put it before my colleague. In the long run, our conservation proposals, as has been the case with all these things in the past, must rest on persuading the other people concerned that it is in everybody's interest that something of this kind should be done; and this inevitably is a lengthy process because it must be based on evidence. If the suggestion made by the noble Lord, Lord Balfour of Inchrye, should prove to be a practical one, it could at least offer some hope of relief until a permanent solution becomes possible.