§ 2.43 p.m.
§ THE MARQUESS OF SALISBURYMy Lords, I beg leave to ask the Question which stands in my name on the Order Paper.
§ [The Question was as follows:
§ To ask Her Majesty's Government whether attention has been drawn to a speech by President Kaunda on May 12, in which he is reported by The Times as saying that "Blood has got to be spilt" to oust the Smith régime in Rhodesia, and to ask whether they will condemn such incite- 1254 ments to violence in Rhodesia, by President Kaunda or anyone else.]
§ THE LORD PRIVY SEAL (THE EARL OF LONGFORD)My Lords, Her Majesty's Government have repeatedly stated that they are opposed to violence from whatever quarter it may come.
§ THE MARQUESS OF SALISBURYMy Lords, I should like to thank the noble Earl for his Answer. I understand I must take it that that applies to the particular case which I had in mind in putting down my Question?
§ THE EARL OF LONGFORDMy Lords, the noble Marquess is at liberty to interpret any Answers that I give in any fashion he chooses, but I must not be thought to be coming here this afternoon to pass a criticism on the Head of a friendly Commonwealth country.
§ THE MARQUESS OF SALISBURYMy Lords, is the noble Earl aware that his second answer will be regarded by a great many people in this country as condoning violence and even murder?
§ THE EARL OF LONGFORDMy Lords, I am shocked that the noble Marquess, whose experience is unrivalled and who occupies a position of special esteem in this House, should have twisted my answer in that way.
§ LORD SEGALMy Lords, may I ask my noble friend whether Her Majesty's Government cannot take some initiative in drawing Zambia and Malawi a little closer together in their attitude towards Rhodesia?
§ THE EARL OF LONGFORDMy Lords, I am glad to consider any suggestions from the noble Lord, or any other noble Lord in this House, in any such direction.
§ LORD CONESFORDMy Lords, since the context of this reported statement shows that the blood which had to be spilt was British blood, surely the Government on that occasion was not showing itself particularly friendly to this country.
§ THE EARL OF LONGFORDMy Lords, if I may say so frankly to the noble Lord, I should have thought that that was not a remark calculated to help the situation in a moment when one of our own Ministers is in Zambia, and when 1255 it seems most unwise to indulge in any premature criticisms.
§ LORD GRIMSTON OF WESTBURYMy Lords, if, in spite of the views expressed by Her Majesty's Government, violence caused from Zambia or elsewhere continues in Rhodesia, are Her Majesty's Government prepared to review the question of oil sanctions in order that the security forces in Rhodesia may not be hampered by lack of petrol?
§ THE EARL OF LONGFORDMy Lords, I should have thought that that was a wildly hypothetical point to raise.