§ 2.36 p.m.
§ LORD LINDGRENMy Lords, I beg leave to ask the Question which stands in my name on the Order Paper.
§ [The Question was as follows:
§ To ask Her Majesty's Government the number of persons between 60 and 65 years of age registered as unemployed and drawing unemployment benefit who were previously employed in banking, insurance, the Civil Service and local government and the average period such persons have been drawing unemployment benefit.]
§ THE MINISTER WITHOUT PORTFOLIO (LORD CHAMPION)My Lords, I regret the information is not available.
§ LORD LINDGRENMy Lords, is my noble friend aware that it is alleged that numbers of these persons on superannuation are drawing unemployment benefit in order to supplement that superannuation and not genuinely seeking work? What action is likely to be taken to stop this malpractice?
§ LORD CHAMPIONMy Lords, the Minister of Pensions and National Insurance is certainly concerned at the possibility of abuse of National Insurance Fund by occupational pensioners and has sought the advice of the National Insurance Advisory Committee.
§ LORD PEDDIEMy Lords, can the noble Lord confirm whether it is true that a person unemployed from the specialist jobs must be offered only a similar job by the employment exchange?
§ LORD CHAMPIONMy Lords, it is not quite that way. Whether a particular job is suitable for a particular person can be decided only by the statutory authorities. Broadly, a retired man would be expected to accept the sort of work that could reasonably be expected to be available to a man of his age in the district where he lived. This would not necessarily mean getting the same salary and doing the same type of work as before his retirement. Indeed, it is scarcely possible in occupations where it is a regular practice to retire men and women at a fixed age.
§ LORD DRUMALBYNMy Lords, is the noble Lord therefore saying that there is in practice a difference in treatment between people who have retired from their normal employment and people who fall out of work in the ordinary way? Will he confirm whether that is so?
§ LORD CHAMPIONMy Lords, I should not have thought that there was a difference in practice. The only way you can test a person's attitude to work is by asking him to consider a particular job, as I am sure the noble Lord knows. But often it is the case that there are no suitable jobs available for the elderly in the sort of circumstances we are considering in connection with this Question.