§ 3.22 p.m.
§ LORD STRATHCARRONMy Lords, I beg leave to ask the Question which stands in my name on the Order Paper.
[The Question was as follows:
§ To ask Her Majesty's Government what action they propose to take, after reading the report of the Association of Optical Practitioners concerning the issue of driving licences to the 1.12 per cent. of more than 13 million holders of driving licences thought to have defective vision; and whether, in the interests of road safety, they will in future insist on an eyesight test before renewal of any driving licence.]
§ THE PARLIAMENTARY SECRETARY, MINISTRY OF TRANSPORT (LORD LINDGREN)My Lords, the Association estimated that 1.12 per cent. of licence holders have vision below the current standard. It does not necessarily follow that licences are being issued to people after their vision has become substandard. Before a licence can be renewed the holder is required to certify that his vision meets the standard, which he can easily check for himself. It is, of course, an offence to make a false declaration. It is also an offence—punishable by a fine, imprisonment or both and possibly by disqualification—to drive a motor vehicle on a road, with sub-standard vision.
The police are specifically empowered to test the vision of any person they think may be guilty of this offence. For all these reasons my right honourable friend is not satisfied that he would be justified in imposing on licence holders, and on the economy, the additional burdens implicit in the noble Lord's suggestion.
§ LORD STRATHCARRONMy Lords, I thank the noble Lord for his Answer. But since it is estimated that about 150,000 drivers hold driving licences illegally, does the noble Lord not agree that this constitutes a major traffic hazard?
§ LORD LINDGRENYes, my Lords, that is true. The estimate of 150,000 is, in the view of the Minister, not an unreasonable one. But one has equally to remember (the noble Lord in his Question 395 was conservative in his estimate) that there are 14 million licence holders. One has also to remember that vision tends to become more defective as age progresses. The under-twenties have four times the accident rate of the fifties to the sixty-nines, and, therefore, while eyesight may be a factor, it certainly is not one of the big factors in the causes of accidents.
§ LORD STRATHCARRONMy Lords, would the noble Lord not agree that it is a factor which has not been considered seriously up to now? I am rather horrified that he should think that 150,000 drivers with bad vision do not constitute a major road hazard.
§ LORD LINDGRENMy Lords, the police have powers. I have the form here which has to be filled in to obtain a driving licence, and it says:
Can you meet the eyesight requirements prescribed for the driving test?If the person answers "Yes" to that question, and it should be "No", then he has committed an offence and can be prosecuted, fined, imprisoned or disqualified.
§ LORD LUCAS OF CHILWORTHMy Lords, is the noble Lord aware that I think the majority of sensible people would support him in this? Have the Ministry any data to satisfy the House that vision outside the provisions of the declaration on the form one has to sign is a contributory factor to accidents?
§ LORD LINDGRENMy Lords, the police did not get the power to test eyesight until the 1962 Act was passed. Tests then started in 1963, and 1964 was the first full year. I will admit straight away that in the vast majority of cases the police test is only made after an accident. In those instances, there were 79 convictions arising from prosecution, and 18 cases in which prosecutions were not proceeded with. I have no figures in regard to the number of cases in which the police found that eyesight was satisfactory. The police, in conjunction with the Road Research Laboratory, are studying the factor of eyesight in accidents; but there are so many factors, that up to the moment the Laboratory have not been able to satisfy themselves, or the Minister, that defective vision is an appreciable factor in the accidents in this country.
§ LORD FERRIERMy Lords, is the noble Lord aware that this Report shows that the simple test covered by the declaration is not sufficient to disclose the failure of vision covered by that 1.12 per cent? Is he further aware that a great many of these people suffering from defective vision are not themselves aware that they have defective vision? Would he ask his right honourable friend to reconsider the matter, in the light of the points brought out?
§ LORD LINDGRENMy Lords, I think it is true that any normal person, at least, knows whether he or she can read a number plate from 25 yards. The standards which are recommended to be put in the Statute by the Association of Optical Practitioners would have regard to visual acuity, colour vision, muscle balance, field of view and depth perception. if we are to get 14 million people to go through that sort of test, it is going to take somebody a considerable time to carry out the tests.
LORD REAMy Lords, would the noble Lord not agree that a large number of people have defective vision with the naked eye, but that the application of spectacles can, under the Act, make them perfectly eligible to drive quite safely?
§ LORD LINDGRENYes, my Lords. And the driving licence application form makes it quite clear that for the purpose of the test, a person who normally wears glasses should wear them when being tested in regard to the visual requirements.
LORD SALTOUNMy Lords, may I ask the noble Lord whether there is a standard number plate for reading as a test? I have seen a great many number plates that are very difficult to read at any range.
§ LORD LINDGRENMy Lords, it must be the Scottish bad weather which throws up mud on to their number plates.
§ LORD STRATHCARRONMy Lords, in view of the obvious interest of the Association of Optical Practitioners in these matters, and the assurance given to the Association by the Parliamentary Secretary and the Under-Secretary at the Ministry of Transport in 1963 and 1965, will the Minister invite representatives 397 of the Association to take part in any further discussions?
§ LORD LINDGRENMy Lords, we are only too pleased to have discussions with anyone who can help us in any way with this problem, which is a material one in regard to accidents on the road. I hope that nothing I have said implies that defective eyesight is not a factor. What I was trying to impress on the House was the fact that it is not a major factor, so far as we in the Ministry can show at the present time.