HL Deb 19 February 1964 vol 255 cc871-2

2.40 p.m.

LORD HOBSON

My Lords, I beg leave to ask the Question which stands in my name on the Order Paper.

[The Question was as follows:

To ask Her Majesty's Government what consultations took place between the Royal Navy and the Royal Australian Navy on the construction of guided-missile ships for the Royal Australian Navy, and whether they will make a statement.]

THE FIRST LORD OF THE ADMIRALTY (EARL JELLICOE)

My Lords, the Australian Commonwealth Naval Board approached the Admiralty in 1960 about the possibility of having two or three all-purpose escort vessels built in the United Kingdom. These were to be of new design, but based on the "Hampshires" and incorporating certain specified staff requirements, including a guided-missile system. Unfortunately, the design effort required of the Admiralty would have caused an unacceptable delay of two to three years in the development of Royal Navy projects. Both sides did everything possible to reach a satisfactory solution, and both regretted that one simply could not be found.

LORD HOBSON

My Lords, does not the noble Earl think that this is a most unfortunate consequence, in view of the tradition which exists between the Royal Navy and the Royal Australian Navy that their vessels have all been built in Britain? Does he not think something ought to have been done to ensure that these two vessels were built in Britain, rather than in the U.S.A.? I am afraid that the explanation given to the House is very weak indeed.

EARL JELLICOE

My Lords, I thought that I had already made it clear to the noble Lord that both sides regretted that a solution to this particular problem could not be found. But I would draw the noble Lord's attention to the fact that the connection of this kind between the Royal Australian Navy and the Royal Navy has not in any way been broken. The Royal Australian Navy bought six coastal minesweepers, worth £3 million or so, from us in 1961: we have two "Oberon" class submarines being built in Scotland at the moment for the Royal Australian Navy: and the Australian Government have made it clear that, subject to satisfactory agreement being reached, they wish to order two more British submarines.

LORD HOBSON

My Lords, but surely we have the design staff available for these guided-missile ships. Having regard to the fact that the "Devonshire" class of guided-missile ship is the best in the world, it seems almost inexplicable that it should not have been possible to build two guided-missile ships for the Australian Navy in Britain, especially with shipyard capacity available.

EARL JELLICOE

I would agree with the noble Lord that the "Hampshires" are as good, class for class, as any other ships in the world to-day. But I would refer the noble Lord to the reply which I gave to his original Question: that the Australian Navy wanted "Hampshires" with considerable modifications, and that would have required a design effort which would have put off other very important Royal Navy projects.