HL Deb 01 May 1963 vol 249 cc175-7

2.40 p.m.

BARONESS WOOTTON OF ABINGER

My Lords, I beg leave to ask the second Question which stands in my name on the Order Paper.

[The Question was as follows:

To ask Her Majesty's Government whether they are aware of the extreme danger to pedestrians of the practice of left-hand filtering by motorists at light-controlled crossings, and whether they will now take steps to prohibit this practice.]

THE PARLIAMENTARY SECRETARY, MINISTRY OF TRANSPORT (LORD CHESFIAM)

My Lords, the green arrow allowing traffic to filter to the left at light-controlled crossings is used only where this is essential to the flow of a heavy volume of traffic. Wherever possible, special measures are taken to safeguard pedestrians, such as the inclusion of a pedestrian phase in the signals, the provision of guard rails, or the siting of the vehicle stop line at some distance back from the junction. Drivers, when turning at a road junction, should give way to pedestrians who are crossing, as they are told to do in the Highway Code.

BARONESS WOOTTON OF ABINGER

My Lords, I thank the noble Lord for his Answer. Has he taken account of the fact that where no arrows are used but there is a straight green light and then a straight red light, it is common practice to filter on the green light, and that a pedestrian who wishes to cross, having waited for the transverse traffic to stop, is then caught by the traffic coming round, filtering to the left? And will be tell pedestrians at what point, at a crossing of that kind, they can safely cross?

LORD LUCAS OF CHILWORTH

My Lords, before the noble Lord answers that supplementary question, may I ask whether he would not agree with me that there is really only one safe way to meet the complaint contained in that question, and that is to have an all-red phase? The pedestrian is in a hopeless position. I would ask the noble Lord to realise that, much as all your Lordships, including himself, pay homage to the Highway Code, not 5 per cent. of motorists who use the roads have ever read it. There is only one way to overcome this difficulty, and that is to have an all-red phase of lighting.

LORD CHESHAM

My Lords, I do not attempt to dispute the fact that the circumstances which the noble Lady has described cause trouble. I also agree with the noble Lord that the all-red phase, which I mentioned in my original reply, plus the other methods, are probably the best means to adopt. I know this is a problem, and I think we shall have to consider, as we are considering very seriously, extending such measures much more widely. It is impossible to generalise on the matter because of the design and lay-out of crossings, and the noble Lady may like to know that this is a problem which is very much wider than one merely concerning this country. I happened to go to an international conference on traffic matters when this very subject was discussed; and I believe our thinking on it is as good as anybody else's.

BARONESS WOOTTON OF ABINGER

I thank the noble Lord, and I am glad to learn that further measures are contemplated. The noble Lord has referred to experience abroad. I do not know if he can tell us whether he shares my experience, that now the only safe way to cross the road is to do so in New York City, which is rather a long way away.

LORD BALFOUR OF INCHRYE

My Lords, arising out of the Minister's reply, could he not consider, when filtering to the left is allowed by a green arrow, having electrically-controlled wording in green saying, "Pedestrians priority", in the same way as there is already wording in red, "Wait now", "Wait", or, in white, "Cross"?

LORD CHESHAM

My Lords, I think so. We are considering the whole of this problem and what additional signs could be devised or provided for the safety of pedestrians and, indeed, of traffic, in various circumstances. There is another method of doing it, which is considered in the road safety world as interesting and which your Lordships can see right at the end of Whitehall—and that is by setting pedestrian crossings back. That is another possibility which may well spread.

BARONESS HORSBRUGH

My Lords, does the noble Lord not agree that it is where there is not a green arrow that it is very much more difficult for the pedestrian? You get the green light in your favour and a car simply comes and swoops down upon you.