§ 11.24 a.m.
§ Order of the Day for the House to be put into Committee read.
§ Moved, That the House do now resolve itself into Committee.—(The Earl of Mansfield.)
§ On Question, Motion agreed to.
§ House in Committee accordingly.
§ [The LORD MERTHYR in the Chair.]
§ Clause 1 [Dead wild geese not to be sold]:
THE EARL OF MANSFIELDYour Lordships will have noticed that there are a series of Amendments in my name which at first sight would appear almost to destroy my own Bill, or at least very greatly to alter it. I think that it would be as well if, in the first place, I were to explain to your Lordships how these apparent great changes come about and how the main purpose of the Bill is, despite them, preserved intact.
449 Your Lordships will be aware that this Bill cannot stand by itself, but must be taken in conjunction with, and is in fact about to become a portion of, the Act which was passed in 1954, in the passage of which I took a fairly active part. It was represented to me that were this Bill to go forward in its original form, it would mean the introduction of a number of penalties of a very much more severe nature than were contained in the parent Act and that they would be applied to offences which, ornithologically speaking, were much less serious than those to which the minor penalties in the main Act applied. I hope that this is not too complicated a way of putting it. In point of fact, what all these changes mean is that we lose the increased penalties for second and subsequent offences, and we lose the power of imprisonment.
Within a very few years, the original Act of 1954 will have to come up for revision. It was admitted at the time to be an Act on a rather experimental basis. One had to see how it worked and then amend it, if and as necessary, in a few years time. In point of fact, the Act has worked remarkably well, though there are, of course, certain deficiencies in it, and certain improvements could be made. Ornithology does not stand still. As an example, perhaps I may be permitted to quote the case of a bird, which is not affected by my Bill or, indeed, by the main Act—that is to say, the collared duck, which now nests in fair numbers in several parts of the country, though it was not even on the British list as a straggler in the year 1954.
When the original Act comes to be amended, which must be within ten years (and I greatly hope that it will be within that time), I am given to understand that favourable consideration will be given to the idea that the penalties for repeated offences should be made much heavier and that imprisonment may well be included as a final resort. With this explanation, I beg to move my Amendment that Clause 1 be omitted.
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Amendment moved—
Leave out clause 1.—(The Earl of Mansfield.)
§ On Question, Amendment agreed to.
§ THE EARL OF MANSFIELD moved to insert as a new Clause 1:
450§ Extension of prohibition of sale of dead wild geese.
§ .—(1) The prohibition imposed by section 6(1) of the Protection of Birds Act 1954 on a person's selling, offering for sale or having in his possession for sale a dead wild goose, save as may be authorised by a licence granted under section 10 of that Act, shall, instead of being limited to the period in any year commencing with 28th February and ending with 31st August, have effect throughout each year.
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(2) Accordingly, for paragraph (c) of the said section 6(1) there shall be substituted the following paragraph:—
(c) a dead wild goose, or, during the period in any year commencing with 28th February and ending with 31st August, any other dead wild bird being a bird included in schedule 3 to this Act or a wild duck, whether or not so included;'
§ (3) In this section any reference to sale shall be construed as including a reference to barter and exchange.
§
The noble Earl said: I beg to move this new clause in substitution of the one just omitted. I think that I have explained what it mainly does, but there is one addition to it, however, which I think is a considerable improvement and to which I should draw your Lordships' attention. That is subsection (3), which says:
In this section any reference to sale shall be construed as including a reference to barter and exchange.
That fills a gap in the original drafting. It means that a person who shoots a number of wild geese will not be able, as he would under the Act, to dispose of them to his poulterer in exchange for a future supply of chickens, or to his local public-house for a number of bottles of whisky or cases of beer. That, I think, is a considerable improvement. In point of fact, the penalty under the main Act of £5 for every goose that may be sold or may be attempted to be sold remains in this addition to that Act. So we are really getting somewhere. It must be remembered that that is a penalty for each bird and not for each offence. I beg to move.
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Amendment moved—
Insert the said new clause.—(The Earl of Mansfield.)
§ On Question, Amendment agreed to.
§ Clause 2 [Amendment of Protection of Birds Act, 1954]:
THE EARL OF MANSFIELDI am now advised that Clause 2 is no longer necessary, and I beg to move its deletion.
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Amendment moved—
Leave out clause 2.—(The Earl of Mansfield.)
§ On Question, Amendment agreed to.
§ Clause 3 [Short title, construction, citation, commencement and extent]:
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Amendment moved—
Page 1, line 22, leave out subsection (2).—(The Earl of Mansfield.)
§ On Question, Amendment agreed to.
§ In the Title:
THE EARL OF MANSFIELDI frankly do not regard this Amendment as being of much importance. It was, however, represented to me that there was already a prohibition of the sale of dead wild geese in so far as the close season was concerned, and that therefore the Title would be better and more properly explanatory if it contained the words "to extend the prohibition of the sale of dead wild geese." I think it is a distinction with very little difference, but as it does not harm the Bill I was quite willing to agree to it. I beg to move.
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Amendment moved—
Leave out ("prohibit") and insert ("extend the prohibition of").—(The Earl of Mansfield.)
§ On Question, Amendment agreed to.
§ House resumed: Bill reported with Amendments.